Hong Kong - V1 vs X50

[Public Enemy No 1]

Summary of Initial findings:
I am now running a Valentine 1 in my BMW330i (E90) and an Escort 8500 X50 in my Toyota Estima 3.5G. Both are satisfactory, providing adequate braking time, but whereas I find I get 1 full second additional forewarning with the Escort over the Valentine, the more subtle mounting of the V1 makes it my preferred detector in my regular car.

Test Methodology:
The V1 is a new model with the latest software version. I am running with X off, k off (only used on the Tolo Highway), ka on, Laser on, ka set to high sensitivity and POP on. The X50 is running with X off, and K off.

Late one night, I cruised up and down the Aberdeen Praya Road. This is a reliable place to pick up a ka band hit and it's easy to loop around after a short distance on either side. There are 3 boxes in the area that share one Multanova camera, and that night the one by the Aberdeen Bus Terminus in the eastbound direction was active.

Google Satellite Image http://tinyurl.com/qe3om

I did one pass with side-by-side high mounting by my rear-view mirror, noting the timing of the alerts and the physical position. I then made two confirmatory runs with only one detector mounted to eliminate possible interference between the detectors. Each pass was made at exactly 70km/h, the posted speed limit.

Performance Results:
The X50 alerted a full second earlier than the V1 on all runs. Approaching the radar on the opposite side of the road, the V1 alerted a very long way off, but it could have been a false alert. The V1 seems very prone to falsing, even with most of the false-prone bands off. With X and K off, the X50 hardly ever falses and I have a higher confidence in its alerts.

Programming:
The X50 programs easily, with an alphanumeric LED panel to guide the user. The Valentine 1 seems to have been programmed by the Marquis de Sade. I have seen MENSA tests that were easier. Honestly, I had more than one giggle at the manual, which I had to download, because it is so complicated that the manufacturer chooses not to provide it in the supplied user manual. If you have ever had the slightest difficulty programming your VCR, resign yourself to running the V1 on the factory settings, which are inappropriate for Hong Kong (limited use of bands and high density of equipment that cause electromagnetic interference) and would result in a very high false ratio. However, once you have the V1 set up properly, it's almost as reliable as the X50.

Quality:
The construction quality of both machines is good. The enclosures are strong and well constructed, the suction cups stick securely on the windscreen and the cables lock into the cigar lighter socket and the enclosure. The buttons are well designed and of a good quality.

One thing that annoys me about both detectors is that the display is angled to suit a left hand drive car, and cars in Hong Kong are right hand drive. It's not a big deal.

Display and Innovation:
Aside from its reputation for sensitivity, I was sold on the V1's Bogey Locating technology. Essentially, this is an arrow pointing up that denotes a stronger signal in front than behind, an arrow pointing down that indicates the opposite, and another light indicating that the signal is about evenly balanced. In addition there is a Bogey Counter that tells the driver how many devices are operating.

In practice though, I found these features too complicated and unreliable to use. The Bogey Locating arrows are flicker between front, side and back, and the alert frequency is a better location indicator. The Bogey Counter too, is too much info at the wrong time. When the alert goes off, I spend my time looking in my rear view mirror to determine safe braking rate and not looking at the display determining how many cameras are scanning me. The other problem is that I can't see which band is alerting in the dark, because I cannot the read unlit text next to the corresponding tiny LED. Eventually, I will get used to the sound of the alert, but in the meantime, I need to leave my cabin lights on so I can read the display.

The Escort X50 has the basic display, which I run, plus the ExpertMeter display mode which does the same thing as the Bogey Counter but shows the hits band-by-band, and the SpecDisplay mode which tells the user the actual frequency of the radar. The basic display works great for me because the band and signal strength are displayed clearly.

I prefer the display of the Escort better, because it is clearer and easier to use.

Accessories:
Having seen all the possible attachment options of the V1, I was a bit worried, fearign that I'd have to buy several attachments and cables later. I was relieved to see the device came with several attachment and cabling options as standard. I can use the cigar lighter socket, or directly wire it into the fusebox. I can choose between 3 sets of suckers or a visor clip. I can use a coiled cable or a long straight cable. That's a nice touch.

I am often told that RD's are legal in Hong Kong. But it makes sense to avoid notice, or I might be 'randomly' pulled over for a detailed car search and inspection and/or breath test. Even if the car and occupants are clean, it's a waste of my and my passengers' time.

Therefore, it makes sense to conceal the detector as well as possible. I found that by mounting it above the rear-view mirror and running the straight cable round the windscreen, the V1 completely blends into the car. Most people don't spot the V1 outside or inside the car till it starts up.

In comparison, the Escort comes with only one proprietary cable. It's too short, it's the curly type and it's really obvious. Even if it's legal, my wife says it attracts the wrong kind of attention. Once, someone tried to race her at the lights after spotting the X50.

Seeing as the Estima is so high and as it has no bonnet (hood) to reflect sunlight, I will probably relocate the X50 low on the dashboard, where it'll be less obtrusive and stand a better chance of picking up laser.

Price:
The Escort cost me HK$3,200 and the Valentine cost me HK$4,200.

Initial Conclusions:
At this stage, the Escort is the clear winner, because it excels in performance, clarity of display and has much less false alerts. I would certainly recommend the Escort over the V1 to a first time buyer, even if he/she is a traffic cop or a radar engineer.

Now that I have a bit more experience and I have learned to program both detectors, I would still go for the Escort, although I'm in no hurry to trade because the V1 hides away nicely behind my mirror.

Next time? Maybe a Beltronics RX65 or STi Driver. [/b]

[Public Enemy No 1]

PS, The V1 features a release bar, that breaks the seal on the suction cups in case you need to remove the RD quickly. It's a great idea, but the same can be added to the Escort using a paperclip and a pair of pliers.

[Dilip]

Hey man whats up?
congrats on your purchase!

i also heard from nvr2fast that you got the veil from him, let me know how that goes.

I suggest you try using EURO mode on your v1. That will give you more than double the range than the X50 if you do that! try it out 8)

[Public Enemy No 1]

Hey man whats up?
congrats on your purchase!

I also heard from nvr2fast that you got the veil from him, let me know how that goes.

Yeah, hopefully we can all get together sometime.

The Veil hasn't gone on yet. As you know we have had rain forecast every day recently.

I suggest you try using EURO mode on your v1. That will give you more than double the range than the X50 if you do that! try it out 8)

I dunno. I am a teeny bit worried about horror stories of out tune multanovas. If you say it's safe in HK, I will switch it over.

[Dilip]

It is true that 1 out of 10 chance you might completely miss a multanova that is out of tune, but when it does work then it works very very well.

U can try it sometime.

Unfortunately I don't have a car anymore but it would be great to meet up soon!

I strongly suggest you go now and turn on euro mode and drive to aberdeen and test out the bird cages multanovas. One of them will always be on. If you dont know how to turn on euro mode, see the instructions in the Valentine section of this site. It is a "sticky"

[Public Enemy No 1]

Dilip, I took up your suggestion and ran the V1 in Euro mode. I mounted the V1 high above the mirror and the X50 low on the dash. Both were mounted horizontally.

I have to say I was glad I was running the X50 in wideband ka, because I didn't pick up a bogey on the Island South / West route and there is almost always at least one in one of those boxes. The X50 gave me confidence that I wasn't passive live multanovas that were out of tune.

The lazy b*ggers stole 'my' favourite multanovas!

In fact, the only bogeys on the entire Island ring road (inc the Aberdeen Tunnel, but excluding Tai Tam through Deep Water Bay) were the one by the Centre for the Performing Arts and the one on the Eastern Corridor by Kornhill. According to the X50, they were tuned at Ka 34.9 and Ka 34.8 respectively.

I was impressed that neither unit falsed much tonight (though only scanning Ka-Eur, POP, Laser), even at one place I usually get a false. In fact the V1 ran false free over the entire circuit, and the X50 gave only a single false peep (to its credit, the false alert only lasted half a second and the X50 pointed out that the frequency was way off).

The V1's Euro mode does add significant range. Thank you for your earlier advice to only accept the new, Euro mode capable version and for your reminder tonight to activate it.

Running in Euro, the V1 had a 1-2 second lead on the X50. So that's 2-3 seconds better than before just on on Ka Enhanced, when it lagged by a second. Of course, I ran multiple passes against each radar with the RDs running together and then alone to eliminate the possibility of RD-RD interference.

However, I don't plan to run it alone in this mode until I start to feel comfortable and confident with it's reliability thus configured.

I'd also like to add that it's a great pleasure running the V1 in Euro scanning mode together with the X50 in SPC display mode. The units don't seem to affect each other and I get the best of both worlds - the advanced warning of the V1, with the confidence and the frequency information of the X50.

[Dilip]

haha,w ow as soon as you read my message you went out for a drive to test it?

actually...... in some cases when the radars are tuned at very low power, then you will see the BIGGGGGGG difference between the X50 and v1 euro mode.

Usually this only happens with the tripod mounted multanova's, the one where there is a policeman sitting near it.

For example, outside the old Kai tak tunnel, onetime me and Jason (nvr2fast) drove past a multanova.

He had ZERO seconds warning. His X50 only beeped when he was parallel to the radar. But my v1 gave me about 15 seconds of warnin time! amazing!

In HKside it's hard to find these tripod multanova's though...

I strongly suggest for now you try keeping two radars at the same time.

When you have time over the weekend, try driving to Klnside, go through lion rock tunnel, then drive to tai po, then sheung shui, then onto yuen long. This way you will go past many more radars and i'm sure you will find one that the X50 can detect but the V1 euro cannot. Usually near the shatin racetrack or along tolo highway near "ma liu shui" you will find the out of tune radars.

Let me know how it goes.... i wish i still had my car, then i'd be going with you on the test!

[Dilip]

I forgot to add....

regarding falses, in HK POP is not used, so i suggest you disable this on both detectors to reduce falsing.

K band is only used in new territories from shatin up to sheung shui and it's very rare.


Later you will find that the V1 will false A LOT when it sees Neon signs, especially in Kowloon, Nathan rd and the most in Tsim Sha Tsui.

Also i found that some mobile phones can cause the X50 to false but not the v1.

Also if there is another car nearby with a lousy detector, it will give out inteference and will make both your x50 and v1 have false alert

[Public Enemy No 1]

Let me know how it goes.... i wish i still had my car, then i'd be going with you on the test!

Well, we can get together next week and I still have both a car and a license!

[nvr2fast]

You can usually find an out-of-tune Multanova along the Tolo highway near the Race Course. There is one that is located on the left (when you are going back towards Shatin/Race Course) that is under a bridge and behind a big blue road sign. I think Dilip might be able to give you a better description. That one has shown to be regularly out-of-tune... a sore point for Dilip as i usually give him the finger while my X50 goes off and his V1 in Euro mode remains completely silent he never dares to speed past there now But note that is not the only place we've seen these out of tune Multanovas, just one of the most frequent locations.

Sometimes the out-of-tune radar is also located on the opposite side, again around the same area, a bit before it.

However, if you are looking for a narrowband detector, the Bel 975R/966R provide better warning than the V1 in Euro mode. The 975/966 were designed specifically for detecting these lower power Multanovas. Right now, it is impossible to say if they will detect these out-of-tune radars as it seems no one has the newer 975R in hong kong, but you are no worse off than if you have the V1 anyway, and worst case it will still warn eariler than the V1 in Euro mode, or miss it altogether, same as the V1 Euro mode.

I actually told Dilip I think the OPTIMAL situation is to use the Bel 975R in conjunction with the X50 in SPEC mode, so you will get the eariler warning with the 975R, but as a failsafe/failover, if the 975R fails to detect, the X50 will warn shortly afterwards. This is similar to your conclusion with the V1.

If you sell your V1, you should have more than enough cash to buy the 975R as it is cheaper, or at least break even, if you wanted to.

But I still reckon it is better to get a warning than nothing at all... at least you'd have minimal time to bleed some speed off... if not, you might be flying by a photo radar without even knowing!

You might also want to check out the VF2 photo jammer... it isn't a plate cover, it actually jams the photo by doing a counter-flash. Radarroy here sells them, and I have an extra unit here if you're interested.