2008 Laser Test & LI?

[hockey005]

Originally Posted by jimbonzzz

X2

That is exactly the reason why we disclose everything, and let the reader decide what to think. We don't make or lose money based on whether or not people read or believe our results. So if someone doesn't like the way we tested, or they don't believe our results for whatever reason, they are of course free to completely ignore our tests and make their buying decisions based on whatever set of criteria makes them feel comfortable.

We take pride in our tests, and we do the very best we can. But the fact of the matter is we'll never be able to please everyone.

and thats why GOL kicks ass

[TSi+WRX]

I think that the biggest problem in this particular industry/hobby is that no-one is willing to accept that just because there may be money involved or that products aren't sourced "blind" or that a couple of people with obvious ties to one side of the industry or another are present, that there *CAN* still exist impartial testing, with good science and good data.

I truly don't understand why this is so.

Basic science research, for example, would not be nearly what it is now, if not for the generosity of the biotech and drug companies' donations and assistance.

Sure, we take tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars from such interests, but do we bias the results we see? hell no. Our peers would shame us to no extent.

So, we never let such issues affect us. We simply report what we observe. We make sure that the science is good, and that the data is not corrupted.

If the truth is reported, then no "conflict-of-interest" will matter.

Certainly, such conflicts-of-interest should be aired for all to see. In the case of the LI reps being on-hand, I think that the GOL has done a commendable job in stating why they were allowed to be there, and what was done to insure that they were not going to impact the results (and come-on, even if the Traffipatrol devices they brought were tampered with somehow, do any of us really care? I honestly don't we'll ever see the Traffipatrol here, in North America, much less stateside - so why would this even matter?).

To me, the GOL's results are valid - and I think that the testing done by the other hobbyist groups as well as individuals in our community proves this to be the case, with similar results reported.

FWIW, that's just my two cents.

But at the same time, most unfortunately, I also think that this viewpoint - that somehow, a test can only be impartial/unbiased if absolutely no monetary nor material compensation changes hands, and no interested parties (or even, somehow, parties with any preconceived notions or opinions) were present - will continue to be a problem as long as certain members of this industry/community continues to poison the waters with their less-than-ethical tactics (i.e. "The Goons").

[Laser-InterceptorUSA]

If I may take a rare opportunity to chime in here.... it's a different world nowadays what with everyone able to buy and test with widely available LIDAR guns and the days of just one industry related Website being the only test result depository, a jammer and it's capabilities or lack thereof can no longer be hidden, faked AND pass scrutiny.

As a famous American once said, "You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time" - Abraham Lincoln

Cliff - C55

[BLINDER-GUY]

It was not just LI that was invited. I am a dealer and I was invited but due to schedule issues I could not attend.The Staton sent me messages to invite me and I appreciate it. So honestly there would have been a couple Dealers there. GoL did not just invite LI.

[TSi+WRX]

^ Also, it bears to be repeated that the GOL *always* sends out a few invites, on a last-minute basis - to both new and old members of the community, with no strings attached (i.e. that they do not require that you participate in the testing, and that you can come and go as you please).

In a way, this, in and of itself, is a type of "peer review," allowing for a level of check-and-balance in that they never know what these individuals are going to post.

If something funny happened, I'd well bet that these observers would not have kept silent.

[djrams80]

I can positively assure all that GOL did everything in their power to make sure the testing results were as accurate as humanly possible. They told me many times to speak up if I questioned anything going on, if I thought something was not perfect or fair or whatever. The results are truly unbiased.

[Z1NONLY]

As Cliff has said, there is simply too much access to police laser guns for a company to try and get by with "juiced" testers and "crap" retail units.

If any manufacturer tries this tactic, they will be exposed quickly.

It's that simple.

[Stealth Stalker]

Originally Posted by radardude

How do you know these guns were not tweeked from them to give their jammer an edge?

Everyone here knows that I am more sceptical than most, but I don't really see your point here. If the gun is "tweeked", it still applies to every jammer evenly. You would have to "tweek" and "untweek" the thing between tests for it to give anyone an edge, which would be really obvious to everyone. And, since so many people out here are doing their own tests all the time, any seriously out-of-the-norm results would quickly be exposed as dubious.

Tweeked jammers? I maintain a healthy scepticism on that issue. But tweeked guns? That's just pretty farfetched, even for this hardcore conspiracy theorist. But hey, there is nothing wrong with thinking out loud. Keeps everyone honest. And that's a good thing. But really, I think all serious questions of GOL integrity disappeared with Elvis.

[Azonehits]

Originally Posted by Stealth Stalker

But really, I think all serious questions of GOL integrity disappeared with Elvis.

I respectfully disagree with you SS. Elvis has nothing to do with it at all. Remember, this is the first time GOL tested the LI proptotype and Elvis just happed to be there. For you to point out Elvis to be the cause of GOL's integrity is very unfair to Elvis. GOL's integrity has been founded even before Elvis came into the picture. I believe that most members who are skeptical about GOL's test are those who didn't even do a test of their own, who has no way of knowing the outcome by their own and who does not even have the products available on hand for testing.

[TSi+WRX]

And to be fair, I also think it's worth mentioning that the animosity between The Goons (aka The Four Horsemen) and the GOL far pre-dates the LI being in the picture.

I truly believe that [i]Elvis[/b]'s involvement in the "LI pre-production" issue simply opened up a route of attack for those individuals to exploit in a most unethical, dishonest, and disgusting manner, and that's all.