Veil install question/idea

[Obioban]

This is really for Veilguy, but I thought it might be useful to everyone.

I ordered a can of G4 this morning. I was thinking about decreased light output, and what to do about it (I live in the middle of nowhere so light output is important to me).

My projector bezel is repainted matte black/red. Could I Veil the entire headlight lense except for a circle, say 1.5" to 2" directly in front of the projector? More to the point, how much would that lessen the effectiveness of the Veil?

It seem to me that that would retain much more of the light output, and without chrome behind the projector it shouldn't be super reflective.

So everyone can get an idea of what I'm talking about, here's a (albeit crappy, iPhone taken pic) of the headlight housing. I don't mind veiling over the inner, halogen, mirrored bit, as that's basically just for flash to pass... but I would like to keep the projector unobstructed.

[Veil Guy]

Negative. The parabolic collector behind the light, would absolutely hurt your stealthness.

Veil Guy

[Obioban]

Negative. The parabolic collector behind the light, would absolutely hurt your stealthness.

Veil Guy

How much are we talking about here? As in, would I still be keeping 75% effectiveness, or would this really take it down?

[mswlogo]

I was thinking this same thing and have the same worry about light output.

My thoughts are the reflector around the bulb is fully used. So what ever you leave uncovered is exactly what LIDAR picks up.

You can't have it both ways.

They "say" it does not decrease light output but I'm a little skeptical.

These old eyes need all they can get.

I'm going to try to measure light output before and after VEIL with a fairly highend camera (both direct and reflected).

If it does decrease I'm gonna see if I can get higher watt bulbs. My lights are conventional stock lights.

[Obioban]

I was thinking this same thing and have the same worry about light output.

My thoughts are the reflector around the bulb is fully used. So what ever you leave uncovered is exactly what LIDAR picks up.

You can't have it both ways.

They "say" it does not decrease light output but I'm a little skeptical.

These old eyes need all they can get.

I'm going to try to measure light output before and after VEIL with a fairly highend camera (both direct and reflected).

If it does decrease I'm gonna see if I can get higher watt bulbs. My lights are conventional stock lights.

Just make sure you don't let the settings change on the camera before and after, or it will all be meaningless.

My headlights are fairly upgraded, as I need all the light I can get. That said, I also need all the anti speed traps I can get

[mswlogo]

Just make sure you don't let the settings change on the camera before and after, or it will all be meaningless.

Of course. Although I may just record how many stops the camera thinks it needs for proper exposure. I'll try to do it both ways.

[JDS]

I just want to say that your headlights look really, really good

As for effectiveness, if you leave the projector uncovered, you'd probably be around 20% effective. Just a guess.

[ELVATO]

Isn't the projector that part that lights up the most when a flash photograph is taken?

[TSi+WRX]

I agree with JDS - that looks HAWT!

But in terms of VEIL performance, I'm completely with The VEIL Guy - there's a reflector assembly behind your projector lens, and without VEIL protecting it, you'll DEFINITELY negatively impact your LIDAR profile.

http://www.radardetector.net/forums/...harm-pics.html

^ That's a fellow Scooby enthusiast's G2 install. Even with three coats of G2, look at the heavy return from the projector optics.

It in-essence works as an optical collimator.

Aside: To an even greater extent, notice how the fogs on this vehicle, which is a projector application, show much higher visible-light reflectivity than the main headlight units above.

Yes, the headlights each received three strokes, per - and the fogs only two....and certainly, that's going to cause a visible difference, but I also think that it has a lot to do with the configuration of the lighting elements.

For the STIs of that vintage, their lighting closely replicated that of the BL/BP chassis Legacys, of which I'm intimately familiar.

The main headlight units are a combination projector (low beam) - reflector (high-beam) unit, which, aside from the projector lens itself, are then capped by an overlying aesthetic/aero "overlens." The overlens offsets the projector lens by a variable distance, but approx. 1 inch. It is to this lens that VEIL is applied.

[ Note, there is a reflector element underlying/surrounding the low-beam bulb as well, to help focus its output through the main projector lens. ]

This is very similar to the setup seen on your BMW.

The factory fogs, below the main headlamp unit, are a projector setup, identical in execution (although not dimension nor focus/spread, of course) to the low-beam projectors. The other main difference is that the "overlens" for the fogs is essentially the projector lens itself.

I believe that the "offset" nature of the main headlamp assembly, when it comes to the projectors, affects greatly the different level of visible-light reflection seen in the above hobbyist's pictures. Certainly, I think that another coat of VEIL (to match the headlights' three coats) would further cut reflectivity on his fogs, but I truly believe that, even then, it will be nowhere near as diminished as his main headlamp units'. ]

If you skip over that part of the overlens that covers the projector lens assembly, you're going to leave a huge "hole" in your headlamp area that's not protected.

Now think about what an incoming LIDAR threat looks like - is is an inverted cone, with the smallest dimeter of the cone at the source of the LIDAR gun, correct? So in looking at it that way, let's say that your headlight housing is hit from a distance where the entire housing is covered by the spread of the LIDAR beam. *BAM*, the un-VEIL'ed portion is hit, and although you've cut-down a significant part of the LIDAR return by VEIL'ing the rest of the headlight, the part that doesn't, flares.

The line of passive defenses is only as good as its weakest point.

[Obioban]

Fair enough.

Idea dropped