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  1. #1
    Yoda of Radar
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    Default LASER GUNS' & Their Max Range Specs'

    Ultralyte 100/200 - 20-20 - Max Range 3,280 Feet - .621 Miles
    Stalker Lidar - Max Range - 4,000 Feet - .757 Miles (3/4 Mile)
    SpeedLaser® S - Max Range - 4,000 Feet - .757 Miles (3/4 Mile)
    SpeedLaser® R - Max Range - 4,000 Feet - .757 Miles (3/4 Mile)

  2. #2
    Suf Daddy
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    Default Re: LASER GUNS' & Their Max Range Specs'

    Great info! This should be a reference sticky on the web site.

    Do you have a source for the info? I sometimes need a "source" to use the info............
    -Suf Daddy

    Quote Originally Posted by StlouisX50
    Ultralyte 100/200 - 20-20 - Max Range 3,280 Feet - .621 Miles
    Stalker Lidar - Max Range - 4,000 Feet - .757 Miles (3/4 Mile)
    SpeedLaser® S - Max Range - 4,000 Feet - .757 Miles (3/4 Mile)
    SpeedLaser® R - Max Range - 4,000 Feet - .757 Miles (3/4 Mile)

  3. #3
    Yoda of Radar
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    Default

    The source is on all the Laser Manufactuers Sites. Under their Spec's.

  4. #4
    Yoda of Radar
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    1. Lidar Gun Description
    Police lidar is 904 nanometers, 5 nanosecond pulses of 25 Watt instantaneous power delivered into a 4 milliradian cone angle at 1 KHz repetition rate. The long wavelength and low average power aids eye safety. The divergence angle on transmit allows the units to be used without a tripod. The time of flight of the pulses are multiplied by speed of light and the resulting distances are plotted as a function of time. A least square fit is used -the slope gives the car speed, and the variance gives a validity test [1] .
    2. Lidar power estimates
    You need to know this power if you want to build a jammer.

    The lidar beam width at 250 meters is about 1 meter^2. The license plate (Colorado) has about .001 meter^2 of retroreflective paint. - 30 dB loss. They are illuminating the retroreflective paint with 25 milliWatts

    The return beam (from the retroreflective paint) is also about 1 meter^2 and the receiving aperture is about .001 meter^2 - 30 dB loss.

    The return (Colorado) is thus 25 microWatts instantaneous power. The effective measurement bandwidth is 30 GHz. Other states have stronger returns, with Georgia 14 times as strong.
    3. Lidar Range
    Lidar range goes as the fourth root of target crossection. This is a very weak function, and so the range for your state probably falls between these extremes of measurment range to the best and worst liscense plates measured by Tom Bell:

    * Georgia license plate, by itself = 2577 ft.
    * Colorado license plate, by itself = 1339 ft.
    * With no plate- detection range of a Mazda RX7 with headlights retracted is around 800 ft.
    * No plate, and the lights covered - detection range < 500 ft.

    The Uniden detector ad (Aug 95 Road&Track p31) claims that:

    * Uniden detector is good to about 8000 feet.
    * Lidar guns are effective to about 2000 feet.
    * Average operating range of police lidar is about 800 feet.

    Craig Peterson has written alot on police radar and lidar, and he makes the argument in AUTOtronics, March 95 that typical radar ambushes are 600-800 feet because the police must identify the car and make a visual estimate of speed as well. This argument may not apply to lidar with its narrower beam, since the beam itself identifies the car.
    4. Stealth
    Stealth is not invisibility, it is just reduction of the range. This may help in combination with a detector, if the police target cars at the far half of their range as defined by the reflectivity of the average car. You get the warning before they get the speed measurement. Without stealth, in most circumstances, lidar detectors only go off when you have been targeted, and you don't have the time to slow down. With some range reduction due to stealth, they might target you before you come into range. They are trained to point at your license plate. If you have a stealth plate cover, your detector goes off, and you have time to slow before they retarget another part of your car.
    A. Lidar targets on your car. (what is most important)
    To find out what is most important on your car, stand with the light source behind you (park in the sun at dawn or dusk), and look at the region of the car right next to the shadow of your ear. You are looking at light reflected back towards the source. Alternately, you can at night use a flashlight held against your ear and pointed at the car. Stand back by at least 30 feet to see light returned at an angle close to straight back at the source. Another technique is to park your car on a dark street, stand >30 feet away and take a flash photo. Most car parts have similar properties in the visible and near IR. Some special materials absorb in the near IR and transmit in the visible and hence this test using visible light is not indicative that a special police-lidar countermeasure is working.

    The license plate is the strongest target on the front of the car. License plates have retroreflective material that returns light in a 4 milliradian cone angle (Colorado plate measurement) [2] . Different States have a very large difference in the lidar return from the plates. Colorado is one of the lowest, using retroreflective paint on only the letters and a thin border. Most large states [3] have better retroreflective material covering a larger area of the plate.

    The strongest reflection of the rear of the car is an array of little corner cubes in the red tail light cover. All cars have a hexagonal array in the plastic tail light covers. These are just like a bicycle reflectors. You can distinguish these retroreflectors from the tail light lens by the array pattern. The tail light lenses are in a rectangular array, and this corner cube array is in a hexagonal pattern. The second strongest target on the rear is the rear liscense plate.

    There is also a corner cube array on the side-front turn signal indicators. These do not present much of a target unless the police target you from the side in which case the cosine factor in speed measurement will give them too low a speed to worry about.

    Next in strength are head lights, brake lights, turn signal indicators, and fog lights. Of these, headlights are highest, followed by turn signals and fog lights. The retroreflection mechanism is interesting. Light enters one-half of the light and is returned from the other half. I suspect that the light enters one half, hits the back reflector, is focused near the filament, expands to the other side back reflector, and is recollimated returning towards the original source. This phenomena happens over a moderately narrow range of angles directly in front of the car.

    Grills, forward facing chrome, and any rounded specular material are the next strongest targets. Look for a bright glint from any rounded surface which always presents one small region facing the source. Flat regions are almost always pointed away from the source and hence do not contribute to the return.
    B. Stealth Techniques. (what to do about these Lidar targets)
    The license plate is the most important on the front of the car, unless you are blessed with a plate without retroreflectors (The only example I know of this is the old California yellow on blue plates) In some states you can legally remove the front plate. In some states it may be sufficient to paint over the retroreflective paint with glossy house paint to match the color. Check your local laws first. Many states use 3M retroreflective material, which would be difficult to paint over inconspicuously. For these states it is preferable to use a lidar crossection reducing license plate cover. One such cover , is reviewed at the end of this document.

    The array of corner cubes in the tail light cover. These are on all cars, and are probably required by law. If you paint them black, a car driving by would not see your car on the side of the road as easily. The only thing I can figure is to get one of the liscense plate covers that block IR, and cut out a piece and glue it over the corner-cube array. (expect new products for this application to come out soon)

    Head lamps, turn signal lamps, and fog lights. Get retractable headlights or glue a section of IR absorbing liscense plate cover over your headlights. Remove the fog lights, glue liscense plate cover over your turn signal indicators. The "smoke" headlight covers that are on the market do a fine job of reducing retroreflection from headlights. The down side to these things is that they really aren't legal in most states.

    The most extreme stealth includes taking care of all other possible glints. Get a flat black car bra, paint over flat surfaces with glossy paint, paint over rounded surfaces with flat paint. These returns are small compared to the Plates, cornercube array, and lamps.

    Lidar (and radar) range goes as the fourth root of return signal power. By eliminating the single strongest return, the best you can hope for is to reduce the range by about a factor of 2 to 4, from reducing your crossection by a factor of 16 to 256. This is because even if you reduce the strongest return by a larger factor than 256, you probably have something else which returns the lidar signal by at least 1/256 as much as this strongest factor. When you eliminate the strong return you still have the other source of returns. To get a range reduction of more than a factor of 4, you probably have to apply stealth measures to multiple reflectors on your car. If you get the license plate, the corner-cube array (back of car only) and the lamps I think you'll get your visibility under the average range at which police target cars.
    Laser Interceptor Dual, Laser Interceptor Quad, Valentine 1 & The Escort 8500 X50 - Blue, Uniden BC296D, GRE500, Lasershield, 2011 Kia Soul +, Yamaha FZ6, 2005 Black Dodge Neon SRT-4,


  5. #5
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    I would take these numbers with a grain of salt.

    I once clocked a vehicle through a windshield with a LA gun at a range of about 10,000 feet - almost two miles - handheld and during the day.

    At SML this year during an overcast part of the day using any target reference on a black vehicle with large headlights, officers were able to get a lock on an unprotected (no VEIL) front at:

    4942 feet - Pro III
    4677 feet - LZ1
    3940 feet - UL LRB

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  6. #6
    Yoda of Radar
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    I suppose it's possible. I wonder why they say the MAX range in the manuals is only 4,000' :?:
    Laser Interceptor Dual, Laser Interceptor Quad, Valentine 1 & The Escort 8500 X50 - Blue, Uniden BC296D, GRE500, Lasershield, 2011 Kia Soul +, Yamaha FZ6, 2005 Black Dodge Neon SRT-4,


  7. #7
    Suf Daddy
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    Each guns different.

    The older Pro II was a 4' beam at 1,000 feet being much wider than the newer guns.

    The manual specs are for vehicles in their intended use as point and clock a vehicle.

    Shape, size reflectivity and atmospheric conditions limit the gun's range.

    If they claim 4,000 feet, the user is expectING to clock a standard car at 4,000 feet.

    Slightly underrate the instrument IMHO.

    Visually, the license plate as a reference point is too small to view beyond 400-600 feet.

    -Suf Daddy

 

 

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