A friend of mine told me that instant on radar is even less accurate than constant on. Is this true?
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Instant on radar accuracy?
A friend of mine told me that instant on radar is even less accurate than constant on. Is this true?
No...Instant on directed at an oncoming vehicle is very accurate. Plus or Minus 1MPH if the gun has been calibrated
Re: Instant on radar accuracy?
Think ur friends full of it!Originally Posted by MerkXRTurbo
I have to agree with the above, instant-on is basically just a short burst of constant on... normally ~2/3 seconds, or just as long as the LEO feels targeting is needed.
He (your friend) may be thinking of POP, which is extremely short (~67ms, or even 16ms), and that is less accurate then constant on, and the manuals for POP equipped guns even state it should not be used to issue a ticket due to error.
How can you have a short burst of constant-on? I mean it's not constant
These radar units are CW.
Continuous wave.
In instant on the transmitter is turned on, warmed up and ready to go. Justa remote switch on and off and that's instant on.
POP is much shorter and Mike from Valentine research claims the Micro seconds, 67ms or less, affects the accuracy of the TX frequency, in such a short turn on/off - power cycle.
Since Mike explains it better, here's Valentine 1's explaination:
http://<<<< ? >>>>/Moreinfo/pdf/POP_pg26.pdf
POP Mode
How the POP Mode Works
The POP Mode is a feature of certain radars made by
MPH Industries. Its only purpose is to defeat radar detectors.
It works by transmitting radar in a short burst — only 67
milliseconds (that’s 0.067 seconds).
What you should know about POP Mode
It is inaccurate. In order to outfox detectors, MPH Industries
has pushed the technology outside the accepted principles
of engineering. And the company admits as much when its
Operation and Service Manual advises users as follows:
“A note of caution: Information derived during the
POP burst is non-evidential…Citations should not be
issued based solely on information derived from the
POP burst.”
Nonetheless, POP Mode is a reality and it will be used at
the discretion of individual enforcers.
Valentine One has full-time POP Protection
There is nothing you must do to activate POP coverage.
It’s built in, and it operates full time. It covers POP on two
bands — specifically the MPH Industries models Bee III
and Enforcer on both K and Ka.
What the “Dee-Dah-Doo” Tone means
Valentine One is designed to recognize — and ignore —
phony POP signals transmitted by poorly-designed
detectors. Occasionally a false alarm will be started before
verification is certain. If it then determines the source is a
junk detector, it will notify you it is retracting that alert with
a “Dee-Dah-Doo” sound. A flashing J ( ) indicating “junk”
will flash briefly in the Bogey Counter.
-Suf Daddy
More POP info from V1
http://www. <<<<< ? >>>>>.com/pop/whatispop.asp
" Yes, their MPH Industries model BEE™ III, with its POP™ mode, gave them an advantage for a while. But now V1 has full-time POP Protection on two bands. Yet a problem remains. When operated in its POP mode, those radars also produce erroneous speed readings every time.
Moreover, we believe MPH Industries knows this feature is faulty. Why else would it advise, in the accompanying Operation and Service Manual, as follows:
“A note of caution: Information derived during the POP burst is non-evidential… Citations should not be issued based solely on information derived from the POP burst.”
In actual testing of a BEE III in our laboratory, we quickly learned why MPH Industries is covering itself in the fine print. The POP mode is fundamentally flawed. It consists of a lightning-quick radar burst, over and done with before a radar detector can pick up the signal. We consistently measured the POP duration at 67 milliseconds (that’s 0.067 second).
Unfortunately for accuracy, that burst is over the speed limit for the BEE III’s own internal components.
All traffic radar units rely on a Gunn oscillator to produce a stable, reference frequency for the microwave beam. This reference frequency must be held constant throughout the entire reading. Here’s how radar works: A microwave beam at the reference frequency is transmitted toward the target. The radar unit then compares the reference beam to a reflection of that same beam after it has bounced off a moving vehicle and returns to the radar unit. The difference between the reference frequency and the reflected frequency—known as the Doppler shift—gives the speed of the moving vehicle.
No Gunn oscillator we’ve ever tested can go from “off” to “on” and back “off” again in 67 milliseconds while simultaneously holding its frequency. This is basic physics. To be “on,” electrical current must flow through the oscillator. As the current begins flowing, it inevitably heats the component. While the device’s temperature is changing, so is its frequency. After a second or so under power, the device will reach its constant operating temperature and it will hold steady at its design frequency.
However, during the short cold start from ambient temperature to operating temperature, the device is literally out of control. Component makers don’t even bother to quantify the frequency change—called a start-up chirp in electronic jargon—because Gunn oscillators are designed as steady-state devices; they’re not intended for cold-start use.
What does this start-up chirp mean for ticket accuracy? The answer is really unknowable, because it’s influenced by a number of variables. For example, how far away is the target vehicle? The longer the distance, the greater the error. What’s the target speed? The slower it is, the larger the percent error. Which way is the target moving? The error adds to the speed of vehicles approaching the radar, and subtracts from vehicles heading away.
Clearly, MPH Industries has stepped into foul territory with the POP mode. In its zeal to defeat detector users, it has created a radar unit operating outside the accepted principles of engineering. Then it has tried to paper over its own technical recklessness by advising police operators, sotto voce in an obscure section of the manual, that they can’t use the BEE III’s key selling feature for its plainly intended purpose.
Question number one: Given the widespread ignoring of manuals, will anyone even read that warning?
Question number two: If they read it, will they heed it?
MPH Industries, in its quest for corporate profits, is playing an unconscionable game with its law-enforcement customers. Traffic radar is bought for one reason; it’s a ticket machine. Promising a feature, then telling the police after the sale not to use that feature for writing tickets, is pure bait-and-switch. Moreover, it dangles a temptation, a moral hazard, that threatens to corrupt enforcement. MPH Industries must be compelled to recall all BEE IIIs at once and disable the fundamentally faulty POP mode."
If you are tagged by instant on- start writing a check.
nice
Nice to see sufdaddy speaking about radar. I thought you were the laser guy? Thanks sufdaddy. Hey, how is your V1 working since you got it back? Any great encounters?
Sure it is, its just a short constant.How can you have a short burst of constant-on? I mean it's not constant
Because technically 'constant-on' isnt constant either, [just to be a smaartaa$ like yourself here], it(the 'constant-on' radar unit) has to vary (as radar units do eventually get turned off, or die), and according to Princeton, the single act of variation in itself means something is not constant... so, so called 'constant on' isnt constant either SmaartAa$Saabr.
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