Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 13
  1. #1
    Newcomer
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    18

    Default Can't do a V1 and X-50 Side-by-Side!?

    Today, I received my updated V1 (version 3.825) from Valentine. I was impressed with the quick turnaround and the packaging of the updated unit. I was very anxious to test the V1 against my new X50.

    I have read so many conflicting reviews that I decided to run my own experiment. I installed both units and drove around some known radar sources. Immediately upon connecting power to my V1, I got nearly a constant X warning with the rear arrow. No matter where I drove there was this consistent X beep. My first response was that the new software/hardware update had somehow ruined my V1.

    I unplugged the X50 and presto---no more X false alerts! It appears that I cannot run both units in a side-by-side comparison. Have any of you had similar experiences?

  2. #2
    Old Timer
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    6,806

    Default

    Yes, running two detectors close to each other can and will lead to interference between them. I also have a V1 and a X50, and when I run both I get a continuous, weak X alert from my V1. Also, I find the V1 doesn't alert as well to K band when the X50 is on. It must be picking up noise from the X50 and filtering it out, and it affects the V1's ability to pick up real K band.
    If I'm passing you on the right, YOU are in the wrong lane!

    If speed kills, how come I'm still alive?

    Active Countermeasures: V1 3.858, Escort Redline, Beltronics STi-R+, LI Dual 7.1x CPU/8.7 Heads (front)
    Other/Backup Countermeasures: V1 3.813 (loaned to friend), Beltronics Pro RX65 M4 6.3
    Vehicle: 2002 Audi A4 1.8T Quattro
    LEO Toys: Kustom Pro Laser II & III
    Encounters/Saves August 2011: Radar 3/1, Laser 0/0


  3. #3
    Newcomer
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    18

    Default X50 versus V1

    Quote Originally Posted by kpatz
    Yes, running two detectors close to each other can and will lead to interference between them. I also have a V1 and a X50, and when I run both I get a continuous, weak X alert from my V1. Also, I find the V1 doesn't alert as well to K band when the X50 is on. It must be picking up noise from the X50 and filtering it out, and it affects the V1's ability to pick up real K band.

    I had the same K band experience...the V1 was very late. I wonder how SML overcame this issue in their tests?

  4. #4
    Advanced Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    7,509

    Default Re: X50 versus V1

    Quote Originally Posted by eb2cool
    Quote Originally Posted by kpatz
    Yes, running two detectors close to each other can and will lead to interference between them. I also have a V1 and a X50, and when I run both I get a continuous, weak X alert from my V1. Also, I find the V1 doesn't alert as well to K band when the X50 is on. It must be picking up noise from the X50 and filtering it out, and it affects the V1's ability to pick up real K band.

    I had the same K band experience...the V1 was very late. I wonder how SML overcame this issue in their tests?
    SML runs the detector one at a time in their tests.

  5. #5
    Advanced Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Southern MA
    Posts
    10,127

    Default Re: X50 versus V1

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbonzzz
    Quote Originally Posted by eb2cool
    Quote Originally Posted by kpatz
    Yes, running two detectors close to each other can and will lead to interference between them. I also have a V1 and a X50, and when I run both I get a continuous, weak X alert from my V1. Also, I find the V1 doesn't alert as well to K band when the X50 is on. It must be picking up noise from the X50 and filtering it out, and it affects the V1's ability to pick up real K band.

    I had the same K band experience...the V1 was very late. I wonder how SML overcame this issue in their tests?
    SML runs the detector one at a time in their tests.
    How detectors should be tested!!!

    If you want to test the differences find a constant radar source and go by it with the V1 on then turn it off and try the same source with the X50 record the mileage on the alert and there you go

    Spoiler: show

    Radar Detectors-V1 & BEL v995
    Laser Jammer-Laser Interceptor Quad
    GPS Camera Locator-Cheetah C100
    GPS Nav-Garmin nuvi w/Trapster
    CB Radio-Galaxy DX-949 w/Wilson 500
    Scanner-RS Pro-96

  6. #6
    Yoda of Radar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Rottweiler Land
    Posts
    10,420

    Default

    Wait though....someone I can't name the web site did a long term road test of the Rx, v1 and X50 and they ran 2 at a time!

  7. #7
    Good Citizen
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    161

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by davekr
    Wait though....someone I can't name the web site did a long term road test of the Rx, v1 and X50 and they ran 2 at a time!
    But, why?

    So they could test the comprimised (sp?) performance of one detector versus another?

    I'll admit that I don't have the best radar knowledge on the block, and even I know that if you run another detector next to a V1, the V1 will pick up the other detector, which can comprimise (sp?) the performance of the V1.

    So, anyone that's running the V1 with another detector (or with TWO other detectors) is only looking to decrease the performance of the V1, so that they can claim that the other brands are working better then they really are.

    It's like anything else - you get what you pay for. If you buy a $20 radar detector from Wal-Mart...well, congratulations. You just got a $20 radar detector from Wal-Mart.

    If you buy the best on the market, you get the best on the market.

    If you do both, and you try to use them together, your just cutting off your nose to spite your face, because neither detector will work to its full potential. And, if your going to invest your time, money, and energy into something, why not get the best for the money - even if all you have to spend is $20, why not get the most value out of it that you can?

  8. #8
    Advanced Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Southern MA
    Posts
    10,127

    Default

    Yeah they way that was done was ok according tech reps at Belscort and V1 with enough distance18"s between the detectors it should be alright....Sethy runs his V1 and X50 together occassionally

    Generally speaking though it is not level playing fields

    Spoiler: show

    Radar Detectors-V1 & BEL v995
    Laser Jammer-Laser Interceptor Quad
    GPS Camera Locator-Cheetah C100
    GPS Nav-Garmin nuvi w/Trapster
    CB Radio-Galaxy DX-949 w/Wilson 500
    Scanner-RS Pro-96

  9. #9
    Advanced Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    7,509

    Default

    Just because two detectors don't set each other off doesn't mean that they arent interfering with each other. Most people know know that sometimes other detectors will cause falses, right? What is not so obvious, is during their regular sweep, most detectors are also scanning for frequencies that if detected, will BLOCK or PREVENT an alert to real police radar.

    For Ka falses, this usually comes from the LO of the other detector producing a harmonic in the Ka band. Detector makers have come up with a novel scheme to filter these falses: If the detector sees Ka radar, and ALSO sees a first or second harmonic that would come from another detector, the alert is blocked, since real police radar does not produce these harmonics like the other detectors do. Just about all of todays detectors use this scheme in some way or another.

    OK here's how it works from what I understand:

    I won't pretend that I know all of the elaborate methods detectors use to function, because I don't. Detectors receive by mixing the signals down to lower frequencies where regular electronics can easily deal with the signal. They use the first oscillator and it's harmonics to mix with incoming signals like so:

    Assuming a 1st LO frequency of 11.5583 GHz:

    X-Band
    11.558 GHz - 10.525 GHz = 1.033 GHz

    K-Band
    11.558 GHz * 2 = 23.116 GHz.
    24.150 Ghz - 23.116 Ghz = 1.034 GHz

    Ka Band
    11.558 Ghz * 3 = 34.764
    34.764 is right around the center of the Ka band



    So, say a detector is receiving Ka at 34.7 Ghz, and it ALSO sees the LO fundamental at 11.558 GHz, or the first harmonic at 23.116 Ghz, (or both!), it would possibly suppress the alert. Usually the detectors also comare signal levels etc so that if the Ka passes a certain threshold in comparison to the harmonic, it will still alert anyway. However, with another detector in the same vehicle, the harmonic will always be very strong compared to the received radar. The detectors might also consider a time frame, the blocking signal does not need to be present at the same time as the police radar signal in order to block it, sometimes if the blocking signal is seen within 10 seconds etc before the police radar it will block the alert.

    And it is even more complex than this: the example above is only the center frequencies. The first LO will be sweeping too, and different detectors use countless different schemes to sweep the LO when looking for police radar, AND these harmonics that are the footprint of an interfering signal. There is also the second and third local oscillators, and also mixer products that will leak from the detector. Most of the tinme this doesn't matter, except when two detectors are operated in close proximity.

    That is just ONE EXAMPLE of why you shouldn't run two detectors together.


    Another reason: with a microwave oscillator operating in close proximity, it likely raises the "noise floor" in different bands. The detectors use singal averaging between multiple sweeps to identify a threat-level signal, so raising the noise floor would have the effect of making it so that a stronger signal would be necessary for the detector to be able to pick out radar signals from the noise.

    Even enclosing the detectors in metal isn't going to prevent this, since a lot of the leakage comes from the antenna.



    And yet another reason:
    Some of the detectors will see the interference from the other detector and "park" on the frequency in order to get a better look to try to determine if it is real police radar. It might determine that it isn't polcie radar, and doesn't alert. This will have the effect of slowing down the overall sweep, reducing their effectiveness to real radar (especially POP!) as long as they are in the vicinity of the other detector.


    It might be OK on some bands/frequencies but not others, it might work just fine until the sweeps of the two detectors coincide with each other in a certain way. But there's just no way to be sure when it is a problem and when it isn't.

    You'll hear some people say that they've done run two together for a long time with no problems, but how do they know for sure? (That is almost like saying that they sped by a cop with an RMR jammer, so it MUST work)

    So bottom line: don't run two detectors in the same vehicle, especially if you are comparing performance. SML and Craig Peterson test with only detector on at a time for a reason, Guys of LIDAR test this way too!

    You can have good results or you can have easy results. Detector testing has never been easy.




    But you don't have to believe me. Here's what those in the industry have to say:

    Michael B, Whistler Engineer:
    http://www.radardetector.net/viewtopic.php?t=1119

    You should never run 2 or more detectors in a vehicle at the same time. While some models may not interfer with each other, others interfere to a large extent. The interference is not necessarily noticed by self alerting but sometimes it woll cause one or both detectors to not report the presence of radar. Distance can also be compramised.


    Mike Valentine
    http://www.valentine1.com/lab/DoItYourself.asp

    First Problem: Detectors hate each other - Every superheterodyne receiver that includes all of today's radar detectors receives and transmits during normal operation. As you probably know, these detector signals sometimes set off other detectors. Out on the road, other detectors are the most common nuisance signal V1 has to deal with. What's not so obvious is this. Even if a detector isn't set off by another one, it's internal defense system maybe be affecting its radar sensitivity.

    Radartest.com, Craig Peterson
    http://www.radartest.com/dector_thankyou-quiz.asp

    ANSWER: FALSE It's a cardinal sin to operate two detectors anywhere near each other. Their detection circuitry interferes with one another and seriously degrades detection performance.

  10. #10
    Professional
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Anchorage, Alaska
    Posts
    1,320

    Default

    Good lord JimB, thats a lot of typing and good info!

    I totally agree 2 side by side is not good, witness the degrade with my own 2 eyes.

 

 

Similar Threads

  1. Has anyone done a side by side comparison
    By Hottytoddy45 in forum Escort
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 10-21-2011, 06:45 PM
  2. Which side is up???
    By Qui-Gon in forum Laser ShifterPro, ZR4, ZR3
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 06-18-2009, 09:57 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •