Laser Mimic question

[compu44]

One bit of information on the mimic that I never noticed being posted anywhere is the option for software upgrades. Did anything ever come out as that goes? Sorry if it's been posted somwhere else, I searched and couldn't find it.

[crazyVOLVOrob]

The best person to ask would be Chris, JTW. I'm not exactly sure about the units except what he told me and what the current distributer has set forth as plans. So i really don't wanna wanna say anything I'm not sure about but from what Chris told me i was shocked and definitely ready to put money down on a mimic, if the price still stays low

He told me that it will be upgradable btw

[JTW]

Yep, the exclusive USA distributor told me it'll be upgradable.

Chris

[JTW]

I would also get a Blinder M20 right now instead of waiting for the Mimic to come out. It's not worth getting a $150.00 laser ticket from a cop because you're waiting to get the Laser Mimic because it's $150.00 cheaper then the blinder.

Chris

[crazyVOLVOrob]

I would also get a Blinder M20 right now instead of waiting for the Mimic to come out. It's not worth getting a $150.00 laser ticket from a cop because you're waiting to get the Laser Mimic because it's $150.00 cheaper then the blinder.

ChrisThats what i keep telling myself since i already got a laser ticket for 21 over but now i don't go faster than 10 over the speed limit and I'm always looking for speed signs

[compu44]

I would also get a Blinder M20 right now instead of waiting for the Mimic to come out. It's not worth getting a $150.00 laser ticket from a cop because you're waiting to get the Laser Mimic because it's $150.00 cheaper then the blinder.

Chris

Laser's not in heavy use around here yet, so it's not a terribly big concern at the moment. More than the money issue, i'm a little miffed at Blinder Dude's responses to your questions, and that's really making me look more at the mimic. I'll give it until yourself or SML gets some tests done on a final unit, as it sounds like the ones that you're getting are in the pre-release stages. If the Blinder revision issues have been resolved at that time and Blinder is on top, i'll go that route, otherwise, I think the mimic may be a better option for me.

[JTW]

I would also get a Blinder M20 right now instead of waiting for the Mimic to come out. It's not worth getting a $150.00 laser ticket from a cop because you're waiting to get the Laser Mimic because it's $150.00 cheaper then the blinder.

Chris

Laser's not in heavy use around here yet, so it's not a terribly big concern at the moment. More than the money issue, i'm a little miffed at Blinder Dude's responses to your questions, and that's really making me look more at the mimic. I'll give it until yourself or SML gets some tests done on a final unit, as it sounds like the ones that you're getting are in the pre-release stages. If the Blinder revision issues have been resolved at that time and Blinder is on top, i'll go that route, otherwise, I think the mimic may be a better option for me.

For those of you who haven't been following along in other threads Compu is talking about my thread in the Blinder Catagory http://www.radardetector.net/Blinder-M20-rev.-number-roll-call-1297t.php

In the thread we could clearly see that some people had different revision numbers. Blinder dude has said in the past that there weren't any "older version m20" in the USA because Blinder international didn't ship any over until the Laser Atlanta Stealth Mode fix was made. After much consideration I started to believe Leon(Blinder Dude), that is until I realized that Blinder puts revision numbers on the back of their M20's. I posted a thread asking people to post what revision numbers they had and come to find out there were different revision numbers! I was shocked because Leon said there weren't any older version M20's and when I asked him to explain the discrepancy of his statements to the proof we had he just got mad and started cursing.

It was a legitmate question and Blinder dude simply didn't answer it and decided to attack me instead.

http://www.radardetector.net/Blinder-M20-rev.-number-roll-call-1297t.php

Chris

[crazyVOLVOrob]

Yes Chris i know what you mean he brushed it off like it was nothing....He also mentioned he offered a new model to you...I hope this is true.

[CLTX11]

I usually dont voice my opinion on things like that (the thread and Leons response) but that is outrageous.

Dont seem like some business owners/managers really know how much customer service represents them. I havent read any post by him and that was the first post ive seen. Bad impression!!!

[robert]

Yes Chris i know what you mean he brushed it off like it was nothing....He also mentioned he offered a new model to you...I hope this is true.

why would a new model be offered if nothing were different? :wink:

no matter, the fact that he offered it is a good thing, just should be more forthcoming about the differences. :D

[JTW]

Yes Chris i know what you mean he brushed it off like it was nothing....He also mentioned he offered a new model to you...I hope this is true.

why would a new model be offered if nothing were different? :wink:

no matter, the fact that he offered it is a good thing, just should be more forthcoming about the differences. :D

Actually, it's more like Leon just shouldn't have lied about there not being different versions. If he would have been honest from teh beginning we wouldn't be having the conversation now and he wouldn't be caught up against a wall in a lie.

Leon never offered to give me a free blinder outright. He suggested that he might be able to give me a new one for some test vids of the Blinder. I never responded because I wanted to think about the offer.

[Seven]

Chris, maybe you should take the new test unit, test both of them old and new then ask the question?
Not that I know Blinder Dude but maybe he was having a bad day, everybody is entitled to bad days, once a while. :)

Cheers and Chill

7

[JTW]

Chris, maybe you should take the new test unit, test both of them old and new then ask the question?
Not that I know Blinder Dude but maybe he was having a bad day, everybody is entitled to bad days, once a while. :)

Cheers and Chill

7

Blinder beating stealth mode or not is not really the point. The point is Leon stated from the very beginning that there weren't any old versions. This was obvously a lie because we do have different rev. #'s.

[JTW]

and Leon always has a "bad day" whenever I question his product. All he ever does is attack me instead of giving me some answers. It's rediculous.

What if Rocky Mountain Radar started to make laser jammers that finally worked, but they never admitted to making bad products in the past? Would you expect me to not say anything about their unethical past just because they offered to give me a new product? That is called selling out my friends and if something is fishy I'm going to bring it up.

For all th newbies out there this topic is based on the past, not the current M20's that are being sold.

I don't care what company you're with. Keep it straight 100% of the time and don't lie to me.

[JTW]

I'm going to stop talking about this now until Monday or Tuesday when I put the Blinder vs Stealth mode video up. Don't worry guys, I'll clearly say in the video this is an old version Blinder M20. I will make it very clear that the new M20 performs differently.

Chris

[antilaser]

Chris, How come last three consecutive posts are all yours? :D
8)
From my short experience about US you really play hard ball when it comes to business (This has no reference with the current thread).

[Radar Roy]

Chris,

(This is going to be long so I will break it up into two posts)

First off your post today really upsets me (and a few other users/dealers) in a couple of areas, I was considering deleting the entire thread, but then I don’t want some to feel that I am censoring you.

At the start of our relationship, you made me aware of the bad blood between Blinder and you and this was confirmed with Leon. I let bygones be bygones.

Shortly after this you came out with your accusation that Blinder was selling old models prior to the update, with Corbin’s personal cell phone number. After I posted information about my early orders documenting that I thought this was untrue, and we spoke on the phone, that attack ended and I was able to patch things up with Leon. I again thought that everything was resolved and let things move on.

Within the past several weeks you then started posting videos and testing of the Mimic, this I didn’t have a problem with. One of the great things about this board is getting new information out to customers.

After my curiosity was raised, I contacted Lance who has the exclusive rights to sell this product within the USA. We spoke about his new product and he agreed to send me one for my testing and review.

Some other items that I learned were:
1: The product is being manufactured in Korea.
2: The product is untested in the US Market

From correspondence I have received in the past eight months, I know that the manufacture of the Mimic is Dongin Electonics Co. LTD. (or one of their subsidiaries which they have 100s). This is one of their websites: http://www.e-sensor.co.kr/index.htm

This company had also offered me exclusive rights to sell their laser jammer in the US Market and they sent me a handful for our testing (I still have a few boxes here). We also found their UK distributor (http://snoopershop.com) and purchased the exact same jammer that they sent to us for testing. Instead of using our own laser guns, we paid Carl Fors $5,000 to do an extensive 2 day testing with us. The results, the models that were sent to us from Korea jammed 60% of the time, the same production model purchased from the UK, jammed 5% of the time. Also the units life expediency was very short, the LEDs were burning up constantly.

At the same time we also checked US Patents and there was an outright patent infringement in several areas and the Korean jammer had no US or international patent application on file.

The UK distributor had purchased over 1000 of these units and was selling them on their website Snooper.UK. We sent them the test results and our information regarding the patents and they were floored. Now they had to ask themselves what to do with over 10,000 of inventory that they should not sell (but do).

[Radar Roy]

After I supplied Dogin Electronics this information that I was not interested in becoming a dealer for their stuff, they did tell me that they would be looking for another US Distributor. Guess that they found one.

Now Lance has said that he will be making arrangements to take the Mimic out to SML for their June test. That is great, but a couple of runs down the track is not enough to prove that the product is worthy enough even though it does jam. I suggest that Lance do what I had done, and schedule a battery of testing and to also purchase some “blind” units and not some juiced units like this company sent to me.

Now back to the main topic of this e-mail, Blinder and you…

I would consider your post inquiring about the serial numbers a good question if it came from anyone else. But your history with Leon tainted it. Leon saw this as another one of your attacks and felt that you were again setting him and his company up and he replied to you the way he did. You then fuel the fire again calling him a liar.

The most important thing about running a reputable business is setting up a foundation of trust between your customers, clients, employees and clients. Over the past several years I have built this level of trust between Leon, Blinder and Corbin. I know the individuals; they have been to my home and my dinner table. I trust them 100%!

Another part of this board is bringing the manufactures/vendors such as Escort, Bel, Valentine and Blinder to the message board to be available to answer honest questions and not be set up for attacks and if there is a question that they cannot answer in a public venue, either because of product confidentially or what ever, that is their right and should not be attacked.

One of the big three manufactures, who has never posted to the board, but reads it on a daily basis, called me on my cell phone at 5:00 am to advise me on this post. His statement to me “You see why we don’t post you’re your board now!”

So this is my take and feel on this entire subject:

1) Your prior history with Leon has led you to continue to publicly bash him and his company products without merit
2) You are promoting a product that is untested in the US market, does not have US or International patents.
3) You are promoting a product from a company that has a bad history (at least with me) that is known to “juice” their products for testing.
4) You are undermining my board with your continued unsubstantiated attacks on vendors

I wish Lance all the luck in the world, but if he follows through with his plans on the Mimic without doing his homework, he will fail. I like Lance, he is a good person, but he cannot afford the expenses and the legal head-aches.

The moment Lance starts selling these, I suspect that the companies that have the patents that this product infringes upon, will be serve Lance with legal notice to cease and decease. Then either he and/or Dongin Electonics will have to spend tens of thousands of dollars to get that stay lifted, and if he loses, he will be out thousands of dollars on inventory...

[JTW]

So this is my take and feel on this entire subject:

1) Your prior history with Leon has led you to continue to publicly bash him and his company products without merit
2) You are promoting a product that is untested in the US market, does not have US or International patents.
3) You are promoting a product from a company that has a bad history (at least with me) that is known to “juice” their products for testing.
4) You are undermining my board with your continued unsubstantiated attacks on vendors .

1) I ask a question. Leon side steps it and bashes me. If you look at the Blinder thread I was very civil until Leon responded the way he did.
2) I show test videos of products. I don't care if it has patents or what politics are involved. I report what I find and I tell it like it is.
3) Same as #2
4) How am I undermining your board by asking a simple verion number question? Escort has different firmware versions and now we know that Blinder does as well. I have always stated the Blinder m20 was the best laser jammer on the market. The Laser Mimic isn't even being sold by anybody. Just a little confused on how your board was undermined here. It's not my fault if Leon errupts over a simple little question.

[Radar Roy]

Chris,

I understand and appreciate your points, however it is coming off as an attack.

Your posts regarding your testing videos are great and I for one appreciate them!

The reader should be able to see the videos and what ever other testing results and then draw their own conclusions from the facts.

When you say “if I don’t get this” or other demands then it comes off as a personal attack. This is how I am reading it, along with Leon, Bob and the “other” manufacture that called me at 5:00 am. (Leon at least waited till I got in at 8:00)

As a reviewer there is a fine line, you need to keep your personal feelings out of the mix.

I know that you feel that Blinder had packaged the some early model M-10s as M-20’s. I argued that this was not true based upon my early experiences with Blinder and the lost sales that I had in a previous post. We then spoke about this issue on the phone and then you and Bob also spoke about it.

You have to care what patents and/or trademarks are even though you may only be testing a product. People are going to read this, then perhaps base their buying decision. I have crap loads of stuff sent to me as well as Carl and other reviewers, all looking for our blessing. Yesterday one company wanted to “Give me 20 units for free” as long as I gave them a good review. Lots of the stuff I have gotten are not type accepted for use in the USA and I just throw those in the trash or return them. Along with your review, you should do a “due diligence” report on the product, manufacture, vendor, etc. Your name and reputation is on the line man!

Another reviewer just last month had another device from Dongin sent to them for testing. In initial testing of the “juiced” unit it also kicked ass. They did not publish a thing about the device because they did not get a “blind” unit to test.

Leon bashed you because you came out with the 1st punch, he does not trust you, pure and simple. This is based upon your prior business dealings with him, your posting of the m-10/m-20 issue, your posting of Corbin’s cell phone number, what would be considered “snide” remarks about him not responding to your post.

Chris, don’t get me wrong with all this, I do appreciate a large part of what you bring to the table, but you need to temper your remarks and get all the facts before you make an accusation such as calling someone a liar and that is exactly what you done.

I want to maintain you as a valued member of our forum and want you to post your videos of what ever (no naked girls please) but please temper your demands on vendors and consider a follow-up with a due diligence report before you promote and/or slam a product.

[happya$$]

What a professional response by Roy. Very well said Roy.

[antilaser]

This thread is so hot that nobody touch's it! 8) Come on Chris, you probably will not get answer's that you want to hear :idea: Do that video with the notice on S.N. and try to make it look tamper proof as possible.

[Blinder Dude]

Guy's that are coming late or just joining the fourm. This Blinder Bashing has been going on for a while. Im not sure if it is because Blinder stoped selling to Chris (jammer test) because of a MAP price issue. I have been up front with the forum and told more about Blinder that I should have. Chris has a unit and has been offered another, I am not sure what's up with his unit it's electronics. As far as the numbers Blinder will continue to make changes to the system only to make it better. Yes I lost my cool yesterday, but truthfully I have had enough Blinder bashing. Do your research we are the best jammer on the market today and plan to keep it that way. So if we make changes along to way it'sonly to make the product better. If we needed to make a software change you guys would be the first to know. Please let us know any changes you would like to see only to make the product better. Thank you Leon.

[leepoffaith]

Guy's that are coming late or just joining the fourm. This Blinder Bashing has been going on for a while. Im not sure if it is because Blinder stoped selling to Chris (jammer test) because of a MAP price issue. I have been up front with the forum and told more about Blinder that I should have. Chris has a unit and has been offered another, I am not sure what's up with his unit it's electronics. As far as the numbers Blinder will continue to make changes to the system only to make it better. Yes I lost my cool yesterday, but truthfully I have had enough Blinder bashing. Do your research we are the best jammer on the market today and plan to keep it that way. So if we make changes along to way it'sonly to make the product better. If we needed to make a software change you guys would be the first to know. Please let us know any changes you would like to see only to make the product better. Thank you Leon.

I give credit where credit is due. Admitting you lost your cool yesterday is quite big of you and most people won't do that. Koodos to you on this. You have also admitted, in the Blinder Forum, that there IS a difference just not that one stated in the forums. That's really all we were looking for. There was a difference in numbers and therefor there MUST be a difference in the Software or Hardware. Thank you for finally answering our questions. If you could go into more detail on the difference I would be curious what they are.

You seem like a good guy and everyone has their bad days. Thank you for finally clearing up these issues.

[crazyVOLVOrob]

Guy's that are coming late or just joining the fourm. This Blinder Bashing has been going on for a while. Im not sure if it is because Blinder stoped selling to Chris (jammer test) because of a MAP price issue. I have been up front with the forum and told more about Blinder that I should have. Chris has a unit and has been offered another, I am not sure what's up with his unit it's electronics. As far as the numbers Blinder will continue to make changes to the system only to make it better. Yes I lost my cool yesterday, but truthfully I have had enough Blinder bashing. Do your research we are the best jammer on the market today and plan to keep it that way. So if we make changes along to way it'sonly to make the product better. If we needed to make a software change you guys would be the first to know. Please let us know any changes you would like to see only to make the product better. Thank you Leon.

I give credit where credit is due. Admitting you lost your cool yesterday is quite big of you and most people won't do that. Koodos to you on this. You have also admitted, in the Blinder Forum, that there IS a difference just not that one stated in the forums. That's really all we were looking for. There was a difference in numbers and therefor there MUST be a difference in the Software or Hardware. Thank you for finally answering our questions. If you could go into more detail on the difference I would be curious what they are.

You seem like a good guy and everyone has their bad days. Thank you for finally clearing up these issues.
agreed

[Blinder Dude]

Thank you, What I am looking for from the forum is ways to make the product better. Making the product easier to install, thing like this. I don't expect it all to be good tell us your problems. I will do my best to answer every question. Do your research before you buy. Thanks Leon

[compu44]

As far as the numbers Blinder will continue to make changes to the system only to make it better. .

Maybe a description of what the various revisions mean to the end user would put a lot of questions to rest.

[jimbonzzz]

Here's what Blinder Dude had to say about it in another thread:


Those #'s are for us to track product. There are up grades made all the time, not for others to know, but for us to track product. If we ever had a recall these up grades or failures would be easy to track.

I'm just speculating here, but it is possible that they don't mean anything to the end user at all. It is certainly possible that along the line, they did some various things that would improve the design, make them easier to produce, or more cost effective to produce, without effecting the functionality of the units as far as then end user is concerned. Things such as combining multiple components into one IC, improving the circuit board layouts, changing component manufacturers, etc etc. Then they slap the Rev# on them so if there's a recall, failures, etc they could tell if the problem was unique to a certain set of components, board design, etc.

Jim

[compu44]

Here's what Blinder Dude had to say about it in another thread:


Those #'s are for us to track product. There are up grades made all the time, not for others to know, but for us to track product. If we ever had a recall these up grades or failures would be easy to track.

I'm just speculating here, but it is possible that they don't mean anything to the end user at all. It is certainly possible that along the line, they did some various things that would improve the design, make them easier to produce, or more cost effective to produce, without effecting the functionality of the units as far as then end user is concerned. Things such as combining multiple components into one IC, improving the circuit board layouts, changing component manufacturers, etc etc. Then they slap the Rev# on them so if there's a recall, failures, etc they could tell if the problem was unique to a certain set of components, board design, etc.

Jim

That sounds entirely plausible. I'm not sure where to go at this point, i'm shying away from the mimic based on what i've read today on this forum about them possibly submitting juiced units for testing, sounds awful Fuzzbuster'esque. On the other hand, I'm still a little uneasy about the Blinder based on some of the things brought fourth by Chris. I guess i'll see how it turns out, i'm still waiting for the speedlabs tests this year before I buy anything.

[Veil Guy]

The fireworks have been really going off lately here.

Representing a manufacturer, I would like to offer some food for thought here, please.

I thinks its wonderful that Roy [with the help of our forum members] have created a place for manufactures, distributors, and end-users to all participate in - what should be - constructive dialogue.

Unfortunately, a number of these threads have deteriorated to the point that the threads are becoming destructive. The health of this forum, for all involved, is vitally dependent upon us all striving for and maintaining healthy information content flows. When this falls apart, we all suffer the consequences.

I got into a lively debate on this subject some time ago and thought the issue was ultimately resolved. Apparently it has not been.

I believe JTW when he states that his particular Blinder unit has difficulty with the Laser Atlanta in stealth mode.

What I have difficulty in believing that this is necessarily a reflection on a series of "early" blinder production units as it has been alleged.

As opposed to some "cover-up" or misrepresentations - as alleged - isn't just posible that JTW's invidual unit has a fault?

Based upon the commentary from both Blinder US and from Roy, new M20 extreme units were delayed until TA figured out the stealth mode. Suggesting the very real possibility that the above possibility is the correct one.

Based upon the REV: numbers I have seen posted here, the REV numbers all appear the same. I haven't seen any indication that the other four alphanumerics have anything to do with REV #s. Perhaps they're internal numbers to identify particular production runs and perhaps nothing more.

Even if they did represent revision numbers (which I doubt) that still doesn't directly mean that supposed earlier revision numbers represent products that don't jam the LA stealth mode. It may simply mean that Blinder Denmark, like any good manufacturer interested in the long-run is continuously making improvements.

Don't all responsible manufacturers do the same thing?

Microsoft didn't start shipping their first version of Windows as XP, did they?
Intel didn't ship their first processor as a Pentium?
Apple didn't first ship their first OS version of the Mac OS X?

Of course not. Product updates and upgrades are a normal process of all manufacturing.

Escort's current radar detector is Rev: 5
Bel's is v3.x
Valentine's is 3.xxxx

We, at VEIL, are always looking for ways to improve upon what we have already developed.

To take a positive thing and suggest a "negative" because of unsubstantiated beliefs is...

I fully expect JTW to post of a video showing his particular unit to have a problem with stealth-mode. What does this really prove?

That perhaps he does have a defective unit. If JTW can demonstrate this across a number of "early" units, then perhaps he is on to something. Until that time, though, it is simply speculation and if it is to be discussed publicly, should be described as such.

From what I have understood, Blinder has made more than one attempt to offer a repair/replacement. What else can they do?

I have appreciated JTW's contributions here and am looking forward to what he is going to find-out with the three radar detectors that we sent him.

I sincerely hope we can keep the content flows on this forum healthy. Name calling - from where ever its coming - is a real turn-off.

I sincerely hope this helps give us all a moment of pause...

The Veil Guy 8)

[sethy]

personally i hope chris isnt to affended ith all of this and still gives us the priveledge of veiwing his videos... ( i have no idea whats going on ) but I respect him a buttload.

[Radar Roy]

Now please don't take my post(s) out of context, I never aledged that the Mimic that Chris tested was juiced, he wouldn't know and either would Lance.

However I am very familiar with the company that I was planning on doing business. I spent $5000.00 in testing fees, $500.00 in airfair and lodging, $100.00 for car rental. But that was allot cheaper then spending $10,000 for 125 units that I would had been stuck with..
[/url]

[robert]

I thinks its wonderful that Roy [with the help of our forum members] have created a place for manufactures, distributors, and end-users to all participate in - what should be - constructive dialogue.
[...]
Unfortunately, a number of these threads have deteriorated to the point that the threads are becoming destructive. The health of this forum, for all involved, is vitally dependent upon us all striving for and maintaining healthy information content flows. When this falls apart, we all suffer the consequences.
[...]
I sincerely hope we can keep the content flows on this forum healthy. Name calling - from where ever its coming - is a real turn-off.

I sincerely hope this helps give us all a moment of pause...

The Veil Guy 8)

Good post, Bob. [I know this is specific to the Blinder, but] the Mac v PC debate is unnecessarily heated, as are Garmin v Magellan (GPS world), and Bel/Escort v V1. Just need to remember each is all different yet unique and good in its own way. Keep the signal to noise ratio high--keep the name-calling and bashing for other sites.

Roy has done a great job on this site--and as it grows it's going to get tougher to control/maintain. It'll be up to all of us to keep the flow of information and discussion going in the right direction. This forum is a valuable source of information. For any one person (or group of people collectively) to destroy that and take it away from Roy would be a shame.

[Veil Guy]

robert.

right on. i hope this forum will continue to shed more "light" than "heat."

the veil guy 8)

[JTW]

Chris's side of the story -- What all of you need to know is wrapped up in a long string of posts. Now it's fair and balanced for all of you to come up with your own conclusions.

Dear Forum,

I am a consumer first and a reviewer second. It is my every right to question why my unit doesn’t work as advertised. I demanded to know what was going on because I spent my hard earned money on that unit. Both of you say Leon is a stand up guy and he probably is 99.9% of the time. It has been too much of a coincidence that I found out my M20 didn’t work against the stealth and to find out later on SML made two conflicting reports, one for Blinder, and one for Laser Atlanta. These two reports conflicted with each other because the Blinder report said that it jammed stealth and the Laser Atlanta report said it did not. Looking at these facts it would be easy to assume that the M20 fix wasn’t made until later on. Both of you have told me that Leon didn’t get any units in until the LA fix was made. A month ago I asked Leon if there were different versions of the M20 and he said there were not. Those past threads died because I took the advice of Bob to wait it out for more evidence. I was done with the “Blinder issue” until I realized that M20’s have revision numbers on the back. Now Leon said in the past there weren’t any variations of the M20 and I came to believe that because we haven’t had any new laser guns hit the market, so why upgrade an already “perfect” M20? Members of the board posted the revision numbers and it was obvious that there were variations of the YW number. My YW number was also a lower number then everyone elses, thus giving the impression it was an earlier model.
[/b]

[JTW]

Page 2

Do you know why it looks like I’m out to get Blinder? Lets think about this for a minute. Who else has laser guns? Out of the 400 people on that board only us three have guns. Rocky Mountain Radar has stayed in business this long because know body has a way to test their units. It’s ironic that my M20 is an earlier version and it landed in the hands of someone that can actually test the darn thing. If 20% of radar detector/jammer users had a way to test all these products and if someone else found out their early version M20 didn’t work either we wouldn’t be talking about agendas. We would be questioning Blinder. I’m at an Xtreme disadvantage to bring up something like this because my version number isn’t being sold anymore and if thousands of people in the USA have my version number only 1 other guy might have a laser gun to test it. I’m a minority in a pool full of consumers, therefore if my findings are ever conflicting with other peoples findings I will be scrutinized to the highest degree.

It scares me that a lot of people just have blind faith in these type of products and they just expect them to always work as advertised. Just because a product works as advertised today doesn’t mean they will always be perfect and that they’ve always been perfect. This industry is unique because the consumers can’t test their products. I realize that Leon is a friend to both of you and if I were in your position I would probably believe Leon’s side over me too. This is fully understood. All I want is for both of you to realize that it’s okay to question someone. If Leon has nothing to hide then his professional answers will bring out the truth. Outbursts and cursing from Leon fueled the fire these last two days and two customers said they would never buy a Blinder just because of the way Leon acted. If Leon didn’t do anything wrong this TRUTH will come out in his responces and logical explanations.

[JTW]

Page 3

There is no question that Leon and I now have bad blood. The question is when did it all begin? Politicians and defense trial lawyers are professionals at side stepping a topic they don’t want to talk about. Instead of answering the question they will frequently attack the credibility of the person instead. The key is to make everyone think about something else, rather then the question that was just asked.

Leon has made it a point that we have “bad blood.” What he wants you all to believe is this bad blood started when I was a dealer for him. This is simply a bold faced lie. Leon is a wonderful salesmen and a dealer of a great product. Even though my M20 doesn’t jam stealth I still recommend the M20 because it’s the best on the market. Anyway, I called up USA Blinder and spoke with Leon’s wife, Bonnie. I knew that I could make money in this business because Blinder is the best. Making money in business is 80% marketing and 20% product. Why do you think Rocky Mountain Radar is so successful? Rocky Mountain Radar are pro’s at marketing that’s why! I may have knowledge about the industry, but I surely don’t have the marketing green thumb. Even if I was able to get my site on the search engine do any of you realize how hard it is to compete with Radar Roy ? Radar Roy has the best customer service and the largest internet presence in this industry. I did not make any money selling Blinders because I did not have the infrastructure or brains to make it happen. Who do I blame for this? I blame myself, nobody else. As a middle class man I simply could not afford to keep this M20’s in stock until they sold at the retail price Blinder wanted me to sell them at. When it all comes down to it I would rather eat then starve because I’m waiting for these Blinders to sell at $350.00 a piece. My only option was to liquidate the M20’s below MAP price. Leon wrote me an email telling me to raise the price(he was polite and kind.) Leon’s email was justified because I did sign a dealer agreement to never sell the units below $350.00. I wrote Leon back telling him that I couldn’t sell the units and I was going to stop selling these after I sold out of the 5 that I had left. Leon wrote me back telling me that his other sellers didn’t have a problem selling them and that was that.

[JTW]

page 4

Leon never cut me off from product. I made the decision to stop selling Blinders way before Leon even emailed me to raise the price. The last of the units were finally off my hands and Leon and I never talked again for months. I was perfectly happy that I had a Blinder m20 on my car and I wasn’t mad at Leon because there was nothing to be mad at him about.

So why does Leon say I have bad blood against him? Duh, it’s because I asked questions and brought up support questions that were negative to his business. The questions I brought up were purely from a consumer point of view and I wanted answers on why my unit didn’t work as advertised. I have been burned by Rocky Mountain Radar before and I sure as heck wasn’t going to get burned by another company. The bad blood started when Leon didn’t answer my questions and decided to attack me instead, making up lies that I was mad because he ‘cut me off.’ How can I respect someone like Leon at Blinder when he makes up lies about me? I never had an issue with him and considered him to be a great man until I saw his true colors on this board.

The only agenda around here is Leon agenda to shut me up, no matter how much he destroys my credibility with his lies. God forbid anyone question blinders performance because they are the God of laser jammers…right. They are the best, no doubt about it. The minute all of you start to give any company in any industry blind trust the less that company will do checks and balances because they don’t have to.

Car manufactures always find out about defects on a first model year car. The manufacture will assess how much a recall will cost to fix the problem compared to how many complaints and/or lawsuits they will get because of the defect. Firestone tires is a perfect example of this. The didn’t say anything about their defective tire making process until the lawsuits and whistle blowers came rolling in.

[JTW]

page 5

Roy mentioned that I said M10’s were put into M20 casing. This is not true. I said that it was a possibility that this could have happened. In an effort to find out what happened to my unit, that was ironically surrounded by a lot of test report coincidences(SML), I asked some hardball questions Leon didn’t like. As a consumer I have the right to question any company why my product didn’t work as advertised. In every single one of my posts I always stated ‘possibilities.” I never stated it was a fact that my unit didn’t jam stealth because I have a different version number, infact you will find in many of my posts that I even brought up the possibility that my unit was simply defective. Making claims that are unfounded can get my butt sued. I’m very much aware of this and I always say it’s a possibility.

Leon offered me a new blinder in exchange for the blinder I currently have. Why didn’t I just take Leon’s offer and shut up? The simple reason is because I’m not a selfish man and I was looking out for all of you. What if I found out Blinder sold thousands of my versions to other customers that didn’t work on stealth mode? I’m not going to shut up just because Leon gave me a deal. I want each and every person that got screwed to get their money back too. Is this so bad? Does this seem like an evil “agenda” to all of you? Once again I’m not saying Blinder screwed people. I don’t have enough proof of this, but is sure seems fishy to me that Leon would get all hot headed over a few questions. If you did nothing wrong then there is nothing to get all suspicious or hot headed about Leon. After 4+ pages you finally answered the version number question we all wanted to hear. You said a month ago there weren’t differences in version numbers and now we find out there are. What else are you not telling us? Leon probably didn’t do anything wrong folks, but that doesn’t give him the right to elude questions pertaining to a customer support question.

I hope all of you can see now that I never had any ‘bad blood’ with Leon until he started to personally attack me on this board. Roy said that my accusations were unfounded, but he never once said to Leon that his accusations on my credibility and integrity were unfounded either. You can’t really blame Roy though because he’s friends with Leon. I stick by my friends to…believing most of what they say as well.

This subject is now dead on my end. You will continue to see test videos from me and I strongly urge all of you to continue buying product from Roy and Bob. Both of them are outstanding gentlemen and I would invite them over to my house for dinner anytime.

I’m willing to put this issue aside now. Thank you for taking the time to hear my side of the story and God bless.

Regards,

Chris
JammerTests Webmaster

[Crash]

Amen. This thing got WAY out of hand. Kudos to you for putting it to rest.

[crazyVOLVOrob]

Good to see that both sides of the story are now heard.