Nose Dive (Brake Dive) when encountering a LIDAR shot = PT??

[1919]

i m sorry that maybe this topic had been discussed before, but i dont think anyone had any serious discussion regard this scenario.

although the GOL test was "the worst case scenario", but it was still under the condition that car continued to travel at the same speed after encountering a lidar shot, in which the jammer transmitter remained level as it supposed to be.
but we know that in the real life, we slam on the brake as our first reaction toward a lidar alert. This can result in serious nose dive (brake dive) particularly if we are traveling at higher speed and the suspension is not like those sports cars. Can someone share your experience, does it affect the PT? or the vertical divergence of the jammer beam is enough to cover the dive of the car head and jamming remain unaffected?

thanks

[stealthJamal]

We tested this just messing around at one of the previous GOL test and the jammer still jammed. It was a Ford Explorer that was used.
Slamming on your brakes is not good when you get hit with lidar unless you absolutely have to. That will just attract more attention from the LEO. Best thing is to brake firmly and quickly without making the car nose dive, then turn the jammer off once at the PSL.

[TSi+WRX]

We tested this just messing around at one of the previous GOL test and the jammer still jammed. It was a Ford Explorer that was used.

Slamming on your brakes is not good when you get hit with lidar unless you absolutely have to. That will just attract more attention from the LEO. Best thing is to brake firmly and quickly without making the car nose dive, then turn the jammer off once at the PSL.

^ I would agree with not "slamming on one's brakes." That's definitely a big tell. :)

However, after looking back at the previous GOL testing with the Explorer, I'm left to wonder if maybe the conclusion you're drawing about the effectiveness of the jammers - despite a strong "nose dive" - will hold-out if the jammers are themselves mounted lower (i.e. either on a smaller vehicle and/or if they're placed, say, in the common location of "below the bumper").

Please let me explain why....bear with me here..... :oops: :)

With the Explorer, from the pictures on the site, the jammers are mounted high on the grill, adjacent to the headlamps.

If this is the case, even with a brake-dive scenario, the jammers are still quite high up - and can still point a long way down the road, versus, say, a much lower mounting as I described above.

Also, I wonder about the scenario of a closer-in engagement - as the incoming and outgoing laser cones both get smaller would this also have an impact on jamming capability (i.e. a "miss").

[stealthJamal]

To give an easy simple answer: An overpass shot is a much worse angle and the good jammers can jam this decently. Car taking a nose drive is not as great of an angle. I wouldn't worry about it unless the person's jammer is no good. But if the person's jammer is no good I wouldn't only be worried about a nose dive, I would be worried about getting hit with laser period.

[1919]

To give an easy simple answer: An overpass shot is a much worse angle and the good jammers can jam this decently. Car taking a nose drive is not as great of an angle. I wouldn't worry about it unless the person's jammer is no good. But if the person's jammer is no good I wouldn't only be worried about a nose dive, I would be worried about getting hit with laser period.

good example!! now i feel much better not to worry about nose-dive.

but i know for fact that some officers when they are not getting a reading in the very 3 seconds, they immediately suspect the presence of jammer, and they will try to aim some where else besides the frond head (i.e. the hood while u r "nose-diving", or the roof). But....that's very rare i would say. and hopefully by the time they have finished their aiming, you would be under the speed limit already.

[TSi+WRX]

To give an easy simple answer: An overpass shot is a much worse angle and the good jammers can jam this decently. Car taking a nose drive is not as great of an angle. I wouldn't worry about it unless the person's jammer is no good. But if the person's jammer is no good I wouldn't only be worried about a nose dive, I would be worried about getting hit with laser period.

^ That's a very logical example and reasoning- thank you for explaining it as-such. :)

As with the OP, I also now feel much better about brake-dive. Even though I do my best to avoid it (I'm a big proponent of downshifting-to-slow under such situations, where safety allows [as it will not have the "tell" of brake-lights, this can also be problematic for following traffic], so much so that I have my countermeasures' kill-switches arranged to best-facilitate this maneuver), the physical location of my front jammers have always given me some pause.

I do feel much better now, with your new example, stealthJamal - and especially as my current springs do take quite a bit out of the nose-dive equation, thankfully, too.

--


but i know for fact that some officers when they are not getting a reading in the very 3 seconds, they immediately suspect the presence of jammer, and they will try to aim some where else besides the frond head (i.e. the hood while u r "nose-diving", or the roof). But....that's very rare i would say. and hopefully by the time they have finished their aiming, you would be under the speed limit already.

^ Indeed, a lot of what should go on in anyone's plans of both purchasing as well as mounting/setup of their countermeasures should be aimed towards protection against the specific enforcement methods of their local and/or "most encountered" scenarios/practices, as well as hardware.

:)

[jws3]

I could be wrong, but I can't see all that many people having the training and quck mind needed to modulate their brakes just hard enough to slow, but not so hard that the nose squats down when hit by law enfarcement.

I pride myself on being attentive, but the few times I've been hit by laser startled me as the V1 and LE30 both went off. I immeidately hit the brakes, but simply didn't have the presence of mind to modulate the brakes to that extent.

Can't stand speed traps. Legalized mugging under the guise of safety. Wouldn't mind trading the LE30 for a HARM missle or two some days....

[TSi+WRX]

I could be wrong, but I can't see all that many people having the training and quck mind needed to modulate their brakes just hard enough to slow, but not so hard that the nose squats down when hit by law enfarcement.

The nose will dive, regardless - it's just the laws of physics. If the vehicle was accelerating at the time of the hit and the driver lifts abruptly thereafter, unless the suspension is well-controlled (and many of today's passenger vehicles' are not), there will be noticeable dive to even untrained eyes.

However, the extent of the nose-dive will of couse always differ, based on exact driver inputs - and again, physics is to thank for this.

Think about driving in the snow. :) Once you get the hang of it, it's like second-nature.

What I like to remind everyone here is that, exactly as you said, using countermeasures is a frame of mind. As with any other "tactical" endeavor, pre-planning and then practice (and more practice) is necessary to allow the motions and actions to become routine, especially under situations of stress.

Knowing what your car will do when you actuate any of its critical controls, towards *any* end, is vital. I typically recommend to everyone to test-out the true capabilities of their brakes and tires in an empty parking lot (away from prying eyes, too) or on a deserted stretch of roadway. It's imperative that one knows the physical abilities of their vehicle - and not many truly know how far this envelope extends, and where the safety margins lie.

Being able to scrub speed just enough to not induce excessive dive has many advantages - including not overly upsetting your passengers - and should be something that's practiced. :)