Here's What i Don't Get

[swarga]

OK, so the latest GOL tests show the ZR4s doing pretty poorly relative to the LI. And yet Erickonphoenix has video after video showing successful jams with the older (and presumably less effective) ZR3s.

Doesn't that mean the ZR4s should be "good enough" under real-world conditions, and that if you've already shelled out $1600 for a 9500ci you don't need to spend any additional $$$ for another jammer?

Discuss. :D

[Sosticegxp]

OK, so the latest GOL tests show the ZR4s doing pretty poorly relative to the LI. And yet Erickonphoenix has video after video showing successful jams with the older (and presumably less effective) ZR3s.

Doesn't that mean the ZR4s should be "good enough" under real-world conditions, and that if you've already shelled out $1600 for a 9500ci you don't need to spend any additional $$$ for another jammer?

Discuss. :D
I've often wondered the same thing...I bought the ZR3 because on the GOL test the year before it did better than the ZR4 the year after - Ultimately I went with the LI up front (after I already bought the ZR3) because it really does seem to work better than the ZR3/4 from the tests I've seen including GOL's and others since the retail version....Also some other folks had said that the ZR3 isn't really in the same league as the LI......I also heard and read that the ZR3 actually performs quite well with all 3 heads together...that is why I have all 3 on the rear (until I can get the LI rear heads...then the ZR3 is going ????? maybe on my firebird?????

[TSi+WRX]

swarga, erickonphoenix demonstrates the specific fact that one should choose their jammer based specifically on what kind of enforcement hardware and setup they will encounter.

With his local enforcers using nearly exclusively PL-IIIs, for which the ZR3 has demonstrated high effectiveness against - on a C6 which has its hardpoints dressed with VEIL and with a CR8APL8 up front - in situations where they start engagements from farther out, it's no wonder that his setup is very effective.

With his current vehicle, you'll see that he's again gone the extra mile with VEIL G4.

Match the jammer to the threat. That's the best way to go, if you're budget-limited.

As long as the threats are a good match, to your tactical advantage, that's all the edge you need.

----

Solstice -

Per the ZR3/4 performance differences, remember, different testing situations will present with different results.

Yes, a point could well be argued that the ZR3 performed, overall, better than the ZR4, particularly as the former could be utilized, without reservation, in a three-heads-all-up-front configuration - but look at the obvious problems:

Lack of LaserAtlanta SpeedLaser "Stealth Mode" coverage on the ZR3, and also, very potentially, significant issues with the new LTI TruSpeed.

The ZR3 may still very well be decently valid, in specific applications, but overall, the ZR4 will be better suited for "today's environment" (the argument of whether or not you'd ever see Stealth Mode usage on the LA, however, is a valid one).

:)

[zr1]

I was guessing that the worst-case-chromed-out-Chevy-HHR was just too much car for the ZR4 to cover. A small sport sedan with some Veil G4 might be a nice comparison. But a second comparison vehicle (extra datapoint) would have effectively doubled the workload for GOL Test '08 to do up properly.

Personally, I'd like to see a bike test someday to figure out our estimates on the small size issue and if it really makes much of a difference. But again, a full day or two, not to mention gathering the guns and countermeasure equipment. Hmmm...perhaps two bikes, a sport bike and a chromed out cruiser...

[Arashi666]

why??? because a corvette is alot easier on a jammer than that crappy HHR

[TSi+WRX]

I was guessing that the worst-case-chromed-out-Chevy-HHR was just too much car for the ZR4 to cover. A small sport sedan with some Veil G4 might be a nice comparison. But a second comparison vehicle (extra datapoint) would have effectively doubled the workload for GOL Test '08 to do up properly.

Personally, I'd like to see a bike test someday to figure out our estimates on the small size issue and if it really makes much of a difference. But again, a full day or two, not to mention gathering the guns and countermeasure equipment. Hmmm...perhaps two bikes, a sport bike and a chromed out cruiser...

The "helmet/rider" issue is also one I'd like to see followed-through in-detail. :)

[swarga]

swarga, erickonphoenix demonstrates the specific fact that one should choose their jammer based specifically on what kind of enforcement hardware and setup they will encounter.

Thank you for the explanation, that makes perfect sense.

That's why I love this forum - I learn so much here. :D

[TSi+WRX]

Glad to be of-service! No thanks needed. :)

That's why I love these Forums, too. Sooooooooooo much information to be had! I learn something new each day, from both old and new members alike!

[focalcivic]

As stated it all depends on the application. I believe the Zr4 overall is a better unit than the Zr3 because it protects wider range of guns. I think in real world conditions you will get decent protection from the Zr4, but that is only if the cop doesn't pan too much, then it is PT city, esp to headlight shots.

For people who do not know what I mean by panning, say for instance he is aiming for the plate (if there is one in your state) and then shifts his gun to the headlight, I feel that is where the Zr4 may fail.

[djrams80]

The ZR4s are not as bad as that super hard to defend HHR makes them seem. Here in SoCal, the only guns we have to defend against are the PLIII(mostly in LA County cities), the Ultralyte(CHP and most OC cities) and soon, the LTI TruSpeed(CHP). The ZR4s do a pretty good job of defending against these guns on a normal car. The Corvette is a very easy car to defend.

Here are the results that RacerX and I got while testing my ZR4s on my 9500ci.

http://www.radardetector.net/forums/escort/35030-9500ci-laser-jamming-test-summary.html

[category4]

I think the C5 corvette is easier to defend with no exposed headlights during the day, the C6 is definately harder to defend with exposed headlights. In our testing they were picking me up at almost 2000', about the same range everyone was getting tagged at with jammers off.

I think that one of the things we fail to take into account is most real world encounters do not happen at less than 500'. I know there are some places like Ohio where it happens but most LEO's seem to target you from a long way off 1000'+, giving you time to slow down before the range drops to where they get punch throughs on the ZR3 and 4.

[spankyaf]

I was guessing that the worst-case-chromed-out-Chevy-HHR was just too much car for the ZR4 to cover. A small sport sedan with some Veil G4 might be a nice comparison. But a second comparison vehicle (extra datapoint) would have effectively doubled the workload for GOL Test '08 to do up properly.

Personally, I'd like to see a bike test someday to figure out our estimates on the small size issue and if it really makes much of a difference. But again, a full day or two, not to mention gathering the guns and countermeasure equipment. Hmmm...perhaps two bikes, a sport bike and a chromed out cruiser...

I'd definetly be up a for a "bike test"

[KnightHawk]

OK, so the latest GOL tests show the ZR4s doing pretty poorly relative to the LI. And yet Erickonphoenix has video after video showing successful jams with the older (and presumably less effective) ZR3s.

Doesn't that mean the ZR4s should be "good enough" under real-world conditions, and that if you've already shelled out $1600 for a 9500ci you don't need to spend any additional $$$ for another jammer?

Discuss. :D
This depends on the laser gun, set up and type of vehicle that is being used. Time and time again, it has been proven that just because 2 vehicles of different models with the same countermeasures does not mean both do well all the time. Size, color and shape of vehicle matters when it comes to performance of a particular laser jammer and in this regard, the ZR4.

[Veil Guy]

I have used the 9500ci (ZR4) for a good number of months now, have had about 10 or so frontal encounters and a couple of rear ones, and for those that know my driving, it's no small feat, I have yet to have an unsuccessful encounter.

This was also true with the Blinders I used to have installed.

To be sure, Veil G2 (with the Blinder) and now Veil G4 (with the 9500ci/ZR4) is certainly there too, but I have yet to find this combination to have let me down and my silver vehicle is not the easiest vehicle to cloak...perhaps a little easier than say the HHR or 300C, but not easy, in any event.

That in no way, takes away my enthusiasm for any other laser countermeasure solution.

Veil Guy :cool: