So the crappy Ka fix is 70 bux WITHIN the 1 yr warranty.

So i finally called beltronics and guess what ? My detector manufactured in october 2006 and bought in november 2006 with an official sticker on it is officially NOT COVERED BY THE ONE YEAR WARRANTY. Yep, thats what you get for spending 500 bux getting a stupid STI off amazon.com....amazon IS an authorized retailer but the retailers advertising on amazon are not. Gee thanks. maybe you morons at beltronics couldve told me that when i called you and asked if it was ok to buy off amazon.
So its 70 bux for the "fix" which i have no way of verifying is going to be on there when i get it back plus shipping.
Yep, thats the sh*tty beltronics customer service in action for you.

sell the pos on ebay!

I realize your mad, and this probably isnt going to help. But I dont think Bel screwed you out of the Amazon advice.

Im not knowledgable enough to say about the fix or that costing money, but the amazon thing I agree.

If you didn't specifically ask them "Is it ok to buy from Amazon.com retailers" then when they answered its ok, they were talking about just Amazon.com. So I dont think they misled you.

Sorry to hear about your troubles.

That is a bit crappy and have my own opinions about why Bel is doing this.

I am overlooking this issue though, knowing the STi is gonna be one hot fire cracker IF this firmware fix really comes through :D

Now that the 33.8 fix is out we are starting to read on this forum what the other radar manufacture zombies (trolls) are trying to focus on....Bel customers support stinks, audio ramp up issues, bla bla bla stuff...heheh

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thestaton

sell the pos on ebay!

---

LOL X2

Also Zurk why did you buy off amazon and it cost $500? If you bought directly from Beltronics it is only $450 and you get a 30 day test drive. Not to mention all your info is programmed already. No need to register...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Buford T. Justice

That is a bit crappy and have my own opinions about why Bel is doing this.

I am overlooking this issue though, knowing the STi is gonna be one hot fire cracker IF this firmware fix really comes through :D

Now that the 33.8 fix is out we are starting to read on this forum what the other radar manufacture zombies (trolls) are trying to focus on....Bel customers support stinks, audio ramp up issues, bla bla bla stuff...heheh

---

Beltronics CS is the joke of the industry. The audible tones are a joke *birds chirping? Ticking Time Bomb?*, the audible ramp up is terrible and by no means linear. and until they admit there is a problem and change the revision, then chicken little will live on and I'll help it live on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thestaton

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Buford T. Justice

That is a bit crappy and have my own opinions about why Bel is doing this.

I am overlooking this issue though, knowing the STi is gonna be one hot fire cracker IF this firmware fix really comes through :D

Now that the 33.8 fix is out we are starting to read on this forum what the other radar manufacture zombies (trolls) are trying to focus on....Bel customers support stinks, audio ramp up issues, bla bla bla stuff...heheh

---

Beltronics CS is the joke of the industry. The audible tones are a joke *birds chirping? Ticking Time Bomb?*, the audible ramp up is terrible and by no means linear. and until they admit there is a problem and change the revision, then chicken little will live on and I'll help it live on.

---

My point just proven by my previous post. :wink:

*****

Any Beltronics unit puchased from an authorized dealer gets a one year warranty.

Their list of unauthorized dealers are on this page: http://www.beltronics.com/unauthorized-list.html and the list grows daily

You'll notice that most of them are ebay and amazon dealers.

Even though the unit may have a sticker on it, many unauthorized dealers have been counterfeiting stickers, we even had photos of these fake stickers on our old site!

There are so many "shady" dealers out there selling remanufactured dealers out there as new, making their own serial numbers and/or removing them, that the entire electronics industry have been forced to take measures as this. Infact Whistler just started this same policy last month!

*****

hope about simply including the serial number in the flash?

and for what it's worth I don't buy all this fake serial # BS. I'm sure it's happened a few times, but if his serial number checks out then who gives a crap. if they can't track serial numbers unless they come from the factory then why even bother with them?

if anything just sell it and forget the headache. go with a Valentine they don't care where you buy it just so it has a serial #. they'll repair it for a cheap $45 dollars.

*****

Quote:

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Originally Posted by radarroy

Any Beltronics unit puchased from an authorized dealer gets a one year warranty.

Their list of unauthorized dealers are on this page: http://www.beltronics.com/unauthorized-list.html and the list grows daily

You'll notice that most of them are ebay and amazon dealers.

Even though the unit may have a sticker on it, many unauthorized dealers have been counterfeiting stickers, we even had photos of these fake stickers on our old site!

There are so many "shady" dealers out there selling remanufactured dealers out there as new, making their own serial numbers and/or removing them, that the entire electronics industry have been forced to take measures as this. Infact Whistler just started this same policy last month!

---

I looked at this link before purchasing to make sure radarbusters.com was still an authorized dealer after the takeover. If I am going to spend 500 bucks on something, then I am also going to do a little research first. I don't really know how the "Radar Industry" works when receiving information about new RD problems. I think everyones tests on here were great, and really opened my eyes to some new information. However, I would not automatically jump the gun to say there was a big problem if I were a major company. I would do a little internal investigation first. I don't know how much about the 33.8 Bel knew, when they knew it, or if they only knew because it was pointed out to them on this site. But I do know that the minute I found out there was a fix on this forum five minutes later I had a work order number no questions asked. I also know that not to much time passed by from the point that everyone on here really started going back and fourth about the 33.8 issue and a fix from Bel came out. Should Bel have a recall? Yes I think so. But I also think it is the customers responsibility to do a little research.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JUS2MCH

I don't know how much about the 33.8 Bel knew, when they knew it, or if they only knew because it was pointed out to them on this site. But I do know that the minute I found out there was a fix on this forum five minutes later I had a work order number no questions asked.

---

Excellent point. Im sure Bel has been hit with many new orders today thanks to the people at GOL and your proof that its occurring.

Its good to have groups like GOL point out flaws so the manufactures can improve upon the product. I would like to see GOL start testing how well filtering algorithms work in different detectors. Maybe the V1 can improve on this once GOL points out some of the V1 issues at hand.

Enjoy

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Buford T. Justice

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JUS2MCH

I don't know how much about the 33.8 Bel knew, when they knew it, or if they only knew because it was pointed out to them on this site. But I do know that the minute I found out there was a fix on this forum five minutes later I had a work order number no questions asked.

---

Excellent point. Im sure Bel has been hit with many new orders today thanks to the people at GOL and your proof that its occurring.

Its good to have groups like GOL point out flaws so the manufactures can improve upon the product. I would like to see GOL start testing how well filtering algorithms work in different detectors. Maybe the V1 can improve on this once GOL points out some of the V1 issues at hand.

Enjoy

---

Just curious as to what exactly you were referring to when you mentioned the filtering algorithms. Other detectors? Weak radar transmissions? Multiple threats?

J/

GOL is about testing and reporting our findings AS IS. We present everyone with our results and let the reader draw their own conclusions. Our purpose is to just test for the love of the hobby and if bugs present themselves we will report them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MEM-TEK

Although it is locked and is protected by "fuses" from what I've read, he said that with the right hardware that it can be done. So, it looks like including the serial number in the flash isn't going to work since a person could read out the code, hack the code with a valid serial number, and then re-flash the processor.

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Nope, if you were going to spend the years and money that it would take to ATTEMPT to do that, you would be better off making $100K+ in that amount of time as an EE in a legitimate business. That is, unless you stumble across something REALLY stupid in the design of the MCU like what happened with OBD-I Honda ECU's using the Oki 66207 MCU (IIRC) and the ROM dump that was so easy to do as a result...

Quote:

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I guess the radar detector manufacturers need to start embedding a randomly generated alphanumeric code which could be laser etched onto a middle layer of the circuit board. Unfortunately, all radar detector circuit boards which I've seen are simple double sided boards without any intermediate layers. Hopefully RD manufacturers can come up with other easily implementable solutions during the manufacturing process.

---

Sure they can do this, but then matching the embedded serial to the sticker would add cost(s). Are you willing to take on these costs (across the board in the electronics industry) to weed out shady dealers? Chances are no....

On a positive note, bel/escort has identified several of these guys making the fake serials and they are working on taking them down.

Maybe this should be made a sticky.

Unauthorized resellers appear and disappear, and may change names often, but purchasing a Beltronics product from any of the unauthorized resellers listed below will subject you to unauthorized reseller risks.

1prada_girl - eBay
6ave.com
12voltwholesale - eBay
A Better Way To Buy - Amazon
a.u.d.i.o.n.l.i.n.e - eBay
aadeals.com
abesofmaine.com
abetterwaytobuy - eBay
abtelectronics.com
Accessory Genie - Amazon
Ace Digital Club - Amazon
acephotodigital.com
AD Sales
aderstine4 - Amazon
alpinejohn - eBay
asavingsonline.com
audeonline - eBay
audionvideoelectronics - eBay
audiovideodimension.com
avmediamarket.com
bfs1230404 - eBay
bluelagoonusa.com
bocaexchangecorporation - eBay
bondb17 - eBay
bmweller - eBay
buycarstereo - eBay
buyerretail.com
caplinktech.com
carmedia1.com
Car Stereo Buys - eBay
CarStereoClearance - Pricegrabber
cartertonryan.co.nz
Champion Audio
compuplus.com
cuttie rabbit - eBay
detectors4less.com
dealznet.com
digitalcorp - eBay
Digital Foto Discount Club - Pricegrabber
digitalfotoclub.com
digitalgiftworld.com
discountcarstereoplus - eBay
discountcarstereoplus.com
dougtheaterman - eBay
ehqonline.com
ekabeht - eBay
elecdeals - Amazon
Electronica Direct - Amazon
electronics-expo.com
electronicsjunction.com
ElectronicsPlus - Pricegrabber
electronuus - eBay
Endless Advantage
etabebe - eBay
etronics - Amazon
etronics.com
excellentcustomerservice - eBay
Explosive Sound
fondus - eBay
GeTtHeBeStDeAlS - Amazon
gopclus.com
greatdeales4uonline - eBay
hibahtrading - Amazon
hibahtrading - eBay
hifiaudioonline - eBay
hmss26 - eBay
homepriceclub.com
hookedontronics.com
hpdirectav.com
hypaudio.com
hypeaudio.net
idealav.com
inetdistributors - eBay
inetdistributors.com
jackandzoe_place - eBay
jamesjones25 - eBay
jasonp9_ - Amazon
jdminstock - eBay
jjielectronics.com
josh5red - eBay
jr.com
ktel6547 - eBay
lgdsuperstore.com
litewarehouse.com
loki123blue - eBay
MB Enterprises (also MBE)
MCM Electronics - Pricegrabber
mcm_electronics - Amazon
MDZ Electronics
neoelektrika.com
nethingnmore - eBay
overstock.com
pac-2000.com
pcplusltd.com
prices_r_us - Amazon
pricesrite.com
radar-detectors.tv
radarandmore - eBay
radarjammertechnology.com
redd4star - eBay
sarjo_distributions - Amazon
savinglots.com
sbhcorp.com
shipdog.com
shop.vendio.com/inetdistributors
shopdigitalcorp.com
shopharmony.com
sigmaenterprises - Amazon
sjgreatdeals.com
sonicelectronix.com
Sound of TriState
sourceoneaudio.com
spawn11587 - eBay
stingrayelectronics - eBay
strasseusa.com
stores.channeladvisor.com/abetterwaytobuy
thewholesalematrix.zoovy.com
thestore4you - eBay
theultimateradardetectors.com
thezeb.com
trademe.co.nz
Titanic Prices - Amazon
tristateaudio - eBay
unameitillsellit - eBay
UnbeatableSale - Amazon
vintegrity.com
Wholesale Matrix
wholesalejim - eBay
your12vdeals - eBay
x-sounds - eBay

cactus man: thanks for that post and I'm throwing this out there and is not pointed at you.

however 2 on that list soundoftristate & tristatesound I have done business with many times in person at there local shop and they are super nice guys. they do all kinds of custom installs and do a ton of work installing belscorts so I'm curious why they are considered "evil"...

if they run a great business then who else on that list does the same? it's a shame someone would have to pay to get the flash, just because the person they buy from may not be official.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thestaton

it's a shame someone would have to pay to get the flash, just because the person they buy from may not be official.

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I agree..

The flash should be free to all owners except to those with tampered serial numbers or those STi's Bel determines otherwise.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thestaton

cactus man: thanks for that post and I'm throwing this out there and is not pointed at you.

however 2 on that list soundoftristate & tristatesound I have done business with many times in person at there local shop and they are super nice guys. they do all kinds of custom installs and do a ton of work installing belscorts so I'm curious why they are considered "evil"...

if they run a great business then who else on that list does the same? it's a shame someone would have to pay to get the flash, just because the person they buy from may not be official.

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^ I agree.

I don't think that this list is there to say that the businesses are "evil" or not legitimate - rather, it exists to state openly that those businesses are not Authorized Retailers, per Bel.

And this, of course, is where things get tough for the end-consumer. One has to shop-smart, and make sure that one's going with an "Authorized Retailer" in order to preserve warranty.

I don't think that this is a great situation. I don't particularly like it. But on the other hand, I can understand the business aspects of this decision, too, and I don't particularly blame Bel for insisting on adhering to this procedure.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thestaton

if they run a great business then who else on that list does the same? it's a shame someone would have to pay to get the flash, just because the person they buy from may not be official.

---

There are plenty of legitimate and decent companies on that list, like ABT and Abe's...the list isn't of "bad" companies, just those that are not authorized, have not made an agreement with belscort to sell at their minimum prices.

Of course bel has a lot to thank them for, as their low prices ultimately get Bel's into more hands and sell more units. This is the exact reason why I bought a Bel, when I did my research I saw the top three at the time were the V1 at $400 fixed, the 8500 at $330 fixed, but the Bel 980's prices were competitive, and I bought it for $250 from a barely-legit place in brooklyn. That $80 difference sold me on the Bel, and I have always been happy with it, works great to this day.

Many of these cheap places do this with many brands. If I suspect they do, especially if they are in any borough of NYC, I call them and ask if it includes full warranty. You would be shocked how many times they say it does not. They will then give you the price with the warranty, and at least you have the choice. If I'm buying something that has a low chance of breaking like camera lenses, I'll usually choose to save the $50. The brands can't hate this, as they are selling the product either way, and in fact don't even have to support it.

Thanks for the comments. This list is from a link that Radar Roy posted:
http://www.beltronics.com/unauthorized-list.html. Actually I have not had any business dealings with any of them. My point wasnt that they were bad, just unauthorized to sell Bel products and customers dealing with them MAY not get a satisfactory warranty or after sales service. And of course I was referring only to the sales of RDs. "Evil" is not a word I used.

Quote:

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if they run a great business then who else on that list does the same? it's a shame someone would have to pay to get the flash, just because the person they buy from may not be official.

---

Mike, I disagree

A dealer is authorized once they agree to purchase the units from them or a licensed distributor and they agree to follow contractual and finacial obligations.

If you're ever along the Mexican border, make a stop inside one of those electronics shops. I've seen Escort, Bel and tons of other electronic goods that are repackaged and sold as new at half of my wholesale cost. Where do they get this stuff, from remanufacturing plants also headquartered in Mexico. (Where all those off brand warranty companies dump their stuff)

So by your theory, "blackballed dealer/distributor" who has been buying his units by the truckload from these electronic shops or remanufactures and then sold in the US, the manufacture should honor a warranty???? No way!

wait what? mexicans have the ability to re-manufacture an STi? As in physically update it? Or just make a new box with shrink wrap?

This industry is so crazy it's impossible to keep up, and I had no idea things like this went on. If that's the case then yes the warranty makes sense, but I think there should be an exception. If I buy an STi from an authorized dealer and register it with Beltronics, then later if I choose to sell it to a friend, it would be nice if I could transfer the warranty.

I feel like I have blinders on like a race horse and we only get to see a little bit. Had I known the whole picture it would make more sense.

Quote:

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This industry is so crazy it's impossible to keep up, and I had no idea things like this went on. If that's the case then yes the warranty makes sense, but I think there should be an exception. If I buy an STi from an authorized dealer and register it with Beltronics, then later if I choose to sell it to a friend, it would be nice if I could transfer the warranty.

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There is nothing to prevent you from doing this, just give a copy of the invoice to your friend

Quote:

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wait what? mexicans have the ability to re-manufacture an STi? As in physically update it? Or just make a new box with shrink wrap?

---

Mike,
Do a google for electronics remanufacturing, there are tons of companies some who specialize with those "second tier" warranty programs where you buy those cards for warranty.

One of these companies is based in Florida and sends all their work to Mexico where the labor is pennies on the dollar.

They do not have the software to do updates and so on. They just replace what they can and send it back out the door.

This practice is across the entire electronics industry. You have "questionable" dealers getting these products from TVs, to cell phones, to what ever and selling them as new...

wow, thanks for the heads up Roy. I retract my comments about Bel and the warranty issue after reading this. that's disturbing...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by radarroy

Quote:

---

I guess the radar detector manufacturers need to start embedding a randomly generated alphanumeric code which could be laser etched onto a middle layer of the circuit board. Unfortunately, all radar detector circuit boards which I've seen are simple double sided boards without any intermediate layers. Hopefully RD manufacturers can come up with other easily implementable solutions during the manufacturing process.

---

Sure they can do this, but then matching the embedded serial to the sticker would add cost(s). Are you willing to take on these costs (across the board in the electronics industry) to weed out shady dealers? Chances are no....

---

The cost to do this would be negligible to the final price of the unit at its current market value.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by parasonic

Quote:

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Originally Posted by radarroy

Quote:

---

I guess the radar detector manufacturers need to start embedding a randomly generated alphanumeric code which could be laser etched onto a middle layer of the circuit board. Unfortunately, all radar detector circuit boards which I've seen are simple double sided boards without any intermediate layers. Hopefully RD manufacturers can come up with other easily implementable solutions during the manufacturing process.

---

Sure they can do this, but then matching the embedded serial to the sticker would add cost(s). Are you willing to take on these costs (across the board in the electronics industry) to weed out shady dealers? Chances are no....

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The cost to do this would be negligible to the final price of the unit at its current market value.

---

I agree.. The same chip that stores the firmware version can also store the SN. There is a good chance Bel could do this now if they wanted to.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by parasonic

Quote:

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Originally Posted by radarroy

Quote:

---

I guess the radar detector manufacturers need to start embedding a randomly generated alphanumeric code which could be laser etched onto a middle layer of the circuit board. Unfortunately, all radar detector circuit boards which I've seen are simple double sided boards without any intermediate layers. Hopefully RD manufacturers can come up with other easily implementable solutions during the manufacturing process.

---

Sure they can do this, but then matching the embedded serial to the sticker would add cost(s). Are you willing to take on these costs (across the board in the electronics industry) to weed out shady dealers? Chances are no....

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The cost to do this would be negligible to the final price of the unit at its current market value.

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Not true, remember I've been to their plant and I have seen first hand how they manufacture and package their units.

Perhaps when they build and move into their new facility next year this is something that they can explore, but this would add overhead and finally extra cost to the unit(s)

I understand the issues with companies selling re-manufactured as new, but in my view, if its got their name on it, with a valid S/N registered to the original purchaser, then you fix the thing. If someone is generating BS serial numbers and Bel or whomever is presented with one of these units, ok, send it back to the buyer unrepaired or give them the option to fix it. But just because someone buys a legit detector through an unauthorized reseller is no reason to crap on your customer. At some point Bel still got their cut on that product.

Camera companies do this same BS with "grey" market items. How dare someone try to save an extra 10-15% by not paying the extra overhead imposed by an "official importer".

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bart99gt

I understand the issues with companies selling re-manufactured as new, but in my view, if its got their name on it, with a valid S/N registered to the original purchaser, then you fix the thing. If someone is generating BS serial numbers and Bel or whomever is presented with one of these units, ok, send it back to the buyer unrepaired or give them the option to fix it. But just because someone buys a legit detector through an unauthorized reseller is no reason to crap on your customer. At some point Bel still got their cut on that product.

Camera companies do this same BS with "grey" market items. How dare someone try to save an extra 10-15% by not paying the extra overhead imposed by an "official importer".

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well said.

Man I am bummed out about this whole $75 fix for the Bel STi. :( That means it would cost me $150 to get both of my Bel STi's software flashed. Seems a bit expensive guys to me. So this means the ramp up on k band would still be the same? What a bummer :( .

Quote:

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Originally Posted by proudNMAmember

Man I am bummed out about this whole $75 fix for the Bel STi. :( That means it would cost me $150 to get both of my Bel STi's software flashed. Seems a bit expensive guys to me. So this means the ramp up on k band would still be the same? What a bummer :( .

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patients my friend, patients.

Just sit back and watch :wink: