Escort ticks me off(skrewing us with the 8500 I feel duped)

I have an Escort 8500 non X-50. Part of the reason I bought it when it was new in Jan of 01 was because it was advertised as "upgradeable for new threats", never obsolete. Well, I Escort today to ask them which firmware version I have and if I should upgrade to "pop" because a year ago this april they told me that they are going to have a pop upgrade available in September of 04. The lady informed me that not only has there never been a performance upgrade for the 8500, but that there are no plans to update it. She told me it was an "engineering decision" not to offer a pop upgrade and that the 8500 will not be upgradeable to KU. I feel as they duped tens of thousands of us who bought the 8500 and that it was merely a technological pit stop en route to the 8500X50. That would be Ok of they didn't advertise it as upgradeable, which was a scam designed to take sales away from the V-1. I would have bought a V-1 if I knew they were lying. At least I could have sent it in for an upgrade without hassle. Anyone else buy an 8500 with the hopes of having it upgraded and feel duped??? I feel almost as if this is grounds for a class action law suit. If they are going to give up on the 8500, Escort ought to offer the 8500X50 to current 8500 owners for the reasonable cost of what they would charge for an 8500 upgrade. Thanks for letting me vent.

Here is their number if you want to call them and voice your concearn:

1-800-543-1608

I myself bought a 8500 in 2001 but decided to take it back and keep my 7500 not as good as the 8500 but it does hack you off. I know I would be upset the 8500 is not a cheap detector. I see why alot of people are buying V1 and Whistler detectors have heard their customer service for both companies are far better. I just wish Bel-Escort would follow the thier lead before its too late.

fireant

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Originally Posted by LS1-Camaro

I have an Escort 8500 non X-50. Part of the reason I bought it when it was new in Jan of 01 was because it was advertised as "upgradeable for new threats", never obsolete. Well, I Escort today to ask them which firmware version I have and if I should upgrade to "pop" because a year ago this april they told me that they are going to have a pop upgrade available in September of 04. The lady informed me that not only has there never been a performance upgrade for the 8500, but that there are no plans to update it. She told me it was an "engineering decision" not to offer a pop upgrade and that the 8500 will not be upgradeable to KU. I feel as they duped tens of thousands of us who bought the 8500 and that it was merely a technological pit stop en route to the 8500X50. That would be Ok of they didn't advertise it as upgradeable, which was a scam designed to take sales away from the V-1. I would have bought a V-1 if I knew they were lying. At least I could have sent it in for an upgrade without hassle. Anyone else buy an 8500 with the hopes of having it upgraded and feel duped??? I feel almost as if this is grounds for a class action law suit. If they are going to give up on the 8500, Escort ought to offer the 8500X50 to current 8500 owners for the reasonable cost of what they would charge for an 8500 upgrade. Thanks for letting me vent. :x

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You know, I'm glad to see you say this... there are so many apologists for Belscort out there who never mention this, but if I recall back when I had an 8500, one of the huge selling points they advertised and folks like Craig Peterson harped on was that it had a software upgradeable motorola chip.... well NEVER HAPPENED!

I've heard this a few times and sorry about that for you. I believe the 8500 was "software upgradable" same as the X50 is now. I presume the reason why you couldnt upgrade to pop is because it has to do with the hardware and not the software. Try to think about it this way. If you bought yours in 01, the V1 has had software and hardware revisions since then that you pay for each time (well after the warranty period) the money that you saved during that time is close to being able to buy the x50. Crunch the numbers of the revisions plus the extra $100 you spent extra for a v1 back in 01 and in those 4 years you could have an 8500 new in 01 and an x50 new in 05.

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Originally Posted by PassportToSpeed

I've heard this a few times and sorry about that for you. I believe the 8500 was "software upgradable" same as the X50 is now. I presume the reason why you couldnt upgrade to pop is because it has to do with the hardware and not the software. Try to think about it this way. If you bought yours in 01, the V1 has had software and hardware revisions since then that you pay for each time (well after the warranty period) the money that you saved during that time is close to being able to buy the x50. Crunch the numbers of the revisions plus the extra $100 you spent extra for a v1 back in 01 and in those 4 years you could have an 8500 new in 01 and an x50 new in 05.

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Valentine advertises their detector can be hardware/software upgraded for a fee. Upgrading to pop from a pre-pop 1.8 costs $55.

The 8500 said software upgradeable to handle any future threats... well the future threats came, pop and KU and OBIOUSLY it was not software upgradeable... in fact I belive they never had any intention of offering an upgrade path, since there is no upgrade address, or portion on their website.

If anything could be software upgradeable, I'd think the pop detection would be... seeing as it is the same frequency, simply a different scan pattern... but what do I know. Maybe software upgradeable to handle future threats means something else.

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Originally Posted by PassportToSpeed

If you bought yours in 01, the V1 has had software and hardware revisions since then that you pay for each time (well after the warranty period) the money that you saved during that time is close to being able to buy the x50. Crunch the numbers of the revisions plus the extra $100 you spent extra for a v1 back in 01 and in those 4 years you could have an 8500 new in 01 and an x50 new in 05.

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If you bought the best Valentine Research and Escort had to offer in the year 2000, you wouldn't have to upgrade the V1 because it killed the Escort in 2000 and it would probably hang with the X50 today.

http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/785...zcustom1qj.jpg


http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/549...zcustom9fq.jpg

Val 1: X 3.0 K 2.6 Ka 4.0 miles
7500: X 1.9 K 1.4 Ka 1.8 miles

That it the difference between the V1 and everything else, you don't have to upgrade it all the time.

I called escort and they told me they did have an upgrade program. They told me I could send in my 8500 and they would give me a whopping 30 bucks towards a new unit. And on top of it their customer service is for the birds. They could give a **** less about their customers

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Originally Posted by BiGeAsYgUy

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Originally Posted by PassportToSpeed

If you bought yours in 01, the V1 has had software and hardware revisions since then that you pay for each time (well after the warranty period) the money that you saved during that time is close to being able to buy the x50. Crunch the numbers of the revisions plus the extra $100 you spent extra for a v1 back in 01 and in those 4 years you could have an 8500 new in 01 and an x50 new in 05.

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If you bought the best Valentine Research and Escort had to offer in the year 2000, you wouldn't have to upgrade the V1 because it killed the Escort in 2000 and it would probably hang with the X50 today.

http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/785...zcustom1qj.jpg


http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/549...zcustom9fq.jpg

Val 1: X 3.0 K 2.6 Ka 4.0 miles
7500: X 1.9 K 1.4 Ka 1.8 miles

That it the difference between the V1 and everything else, you don't have to upgrade it all the time.

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Dang Big do you have this as your wallpaper on your computer. I've seen this multiple times from you. :wink: BTW that's a 7500 they are comparing it to. If you bought one in 2000 would it still be that ugly? Looks like a paper weight I have in my office. :lol:

I remember years ago the cable boxes had this big knob that you had to turn to change the channels and now they're digital. Kind of reminds me of the V1 with that big knob on it that you have to turn.

Bel did the same thing with their advertisement as well, they said you would be able to upgrade the 980 and 985 models thru software and they never did as well.
I know Bel and Escort are the same company now but I think back in 2000 and 2001 when these units came out they were seperate companies?

I am suprised someone has not filed a class action suit against Escort/Bel over this.

Not only has noboy filed a lawsuit, but what boggles my mind is that many of the Belscort fans defend this practice!

They say, "hey, I don't mind buying a new one."

I just don't get it. Because the other brand is more expensive initially, it justifies in their mind that they were duped on a major major selling point of their detector.

yep, id say this is as good as RMR saying their jammers work. I own a Bel and am personally annoyed at their practices. Absolute crap.

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Originally Posted by stalker

yep, id say this is as good as RMR saying their jammers work. I own a Bel and am personally annoyed at their practices. Absolute crap.

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I totally agree with you Stalker. I have had my RX65 for about two weeks and Bel has assured me that if new threats arise that they will upgrade. I take this like a grain of salt because everyone I seem to speak to at Bel tells me that revisions don't matter. I told them that I wanted the latest revision, and they explained that the revisions are just a way for their engineers to identify the RX65. Smells like BS to me. If this is the case then why are there different revisions? Should only be one revision if it's true what they are saying. Just like with computer motherboards, there are different revisions in which certain upgrades and bugs were fixed. I know that there is a difference between revision 4.5 and 3.6 but Bel won't disclose what it is. I think it is a shame that we spend a lot of money on these detectors and we are short changed later on down the road. If and when a new threat emerges, I am going to raise hell with Bel if and upgrade is not offered.

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Originally Posted by aust3333

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Originally Posted by stalker

yep, id say this is as good as RMR saying their jammers work. I own a Bel and am personally annoyed at their practices. Absolute crap.

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I totally agree with you Stalker. I have had my RX65 for about two weeks and Bel has assured me that if new threats arise that they will upgrade. I take this like a grain of salt because everyone I seem to speak to at Bel tells me that revisions don't matter. I told them that I wanted the latest revision, and they explained that the revisions are just a way for their engineers to identify the RX65. Smells like BS to me. If this is the case then why are there different revisions? Should only be one revision if it's true what they are saying. Just like with computer motherboards, there are different revisions in which certain upgrades and bugs were fixed. I know that there is a difference between revision 4.5 and 3.6 but Bel won't disclose what it is. I think it is a shame that we spend a lot of money on these detectors and we are short changed later on down the road. If and when a new threat emerges, I am going to raise hell with Bel if and upgrade is not offered.

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This would not be a problem if the upgradeability wasn't one of their biggest selling points.

The valentine is very expensive, and upgrades cost cash, but at least its What you see is what you get... very clear upgrade path advertised on their site.

Pre-Pop 1.8 -> current = $55
8500 (pre-pop) to x50 (post pop) = Price of new detector -$30.


I have to say, I was actually shocked when they came out with an X50 but offered no proper upgrade path.

What can be done with the Escorts and Bels is to sell the units and purchase a new one. Still costs you more than a few dollars. However, doing this practice with a Valentine One usually ends up in you netting a profit (!) and having new units.

I used to use a Bel detector, and never even contacted Belscort once about it. However, I am likely to own another, and wonder if the famous customer service offered by the company will affect me...

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Originally Posted by lordhamster

....The 8500 said software upgradeable to handle any future threats... well the future threats came, pop and KU and OBIOUSLY it was not software upgradeable... in fact I belive they never had any intention of offering an upgrade path, since there is no upgrade address, or portion on their website.

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Yeah, i remember the same thing when i was looking to upgrade.
Now i never called them, but even if i did, i would have said forget it for 30 bucks. i can keep it as a backup, or probably get more than that on ebay.

I think the top 3. (well top 2, Belscort and VR), have become somewhat complacent with their customer service and products. With the exception of the V1's Laser performance, i'm not overly impressed with anyone at this point.
I would love to see someone like Whistler come out with something that takes the best of all 3 and then takes a big financial chunk out of their butts. then maybe they'll get back to coming out with the next greatest and remember that happy customers are repeat customers that also spread the word about what they have, leading to more happy customers.

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Originally Posted by PassportToSpeed

I've heard this a few times and sorry about that for you. I believe the 8500 was "software upgradable" same as the X50 is now. I presume the reason why you couldnt upgrade to pop is because it has to do with the hardware and not the software. Try to think about it this way. If you bought yours in 01, the V1 has had software and hardware revisions since then that you pay for each time (well after the warranty period) the money that you saved during that time is close to being able to buy the x50. Crunch the numbers of the revisions plus the extra $100 you spent extra for a v1 back in 01 and in those 4 years you could have an 8500 new in 01 and an x50 new in 05.

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I know I had a x50 blue for 14 months and when I sold it I lost $90 and two months out of warranty I paid $60 to have it updated/fixed. I have heard a lot of people having problems wth their Belscort products on this website. I knew KU was coming and I was not going to take a chance of getting nothing for my "upgradeable" x50 when it became obsolete with no KU band detection. Also Escort's customer service is terrible. There is also the issue of the x50 not picking up quick triggered KA in Jammer Tests's videos. There are some assumptions here, but for piece of mind I sold mine on ebay and I am looking at buying the V1.

Belscort are BOLD FACED LIARS........same deal with my Bel Vector 985.
Everytime I contacted them all I got was scripted and rehearsed BULL$HIT.

I just bought a new RD.......a V1.

Ok guys I understand your concerns but...

You go to the store, buy brand name computer with all the latest gadgets and the newest CPU. Lets call it model a-1.

The company advertises that all software upgrades for THIS computer you bought are free from all threats.

Well NEW threat emerges, software update itself cannot stop this threat, it takes a new CPU and motherboard change.

Computer manufacture redesigns their computer with new CPU, motherboard, and software. New computer a-1-x50

Now are you entitled to an “free upgrade” for this new computer, think not..

I have to disagree with you Roy, buy Nortons Antivirus, that comes with free upgrades as new threats arise as advetised by nortons, now Bel and Escort both say their detectors are "software Upgradable" as new threats arive but then when you call them they say it cant be one.

Sounds like alot of false claims to me.

Yes i own a Bel but I am as annoyed as everyone else on here about their false claims.

As much as i hate the look of V1, at least i can upgrade it...hey I dont mind paying bel for an upgrade...but they still wont do it.

BUT......it can be upgraded.....that's the difference

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Originally Posted by RadarRoy

Ok guys I understand your concerns but...

You go to the store, buy brand name computer with all the latest gadgets and the newest CPU. Lets call it model a-1.

The company advertises that all software upgrades for THIS computer you bought are free from all threats.

Well NEW threat emerges, software update itself cannot stop this threat, it takes a new CPU and motherboard change.

Computer manufacture redesigns their computer with new CPU, motherboard, and software. New computer a-1-x50

Now are you entitled to an “free upgrade” for this new computer, think not..

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Not a "free upgrade", just not having to put out another $300 every 2-3 years. The key point here is the advertisement of upgradeable when it is not.

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Originally Posted by RadarRoy

Ok guys I understand your concerns but...

You go to the store, buy brand name computer with all the latest gadgets and the newest CPU. Lets call it model a-1.

The company advertises that all software upgrades for THIS computer you bought are free from all threats.

Well NEW threat emerges, software update itself cannot stop this threat, it takes a new CPU and motherboard change.

Computer manufacture redesigns their computer with new CPU, motherboard, and software. New computer a-1-x50

Now are you entitled to an “free upgrade” for this new computer, think not..

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OK, i would understand your point if they didn't advertise "NEVER OBSOLITE". Also, I called them last year and they assured me that POP upgrade would be released within 6 months of releasing the 850 X50. I dont see how you can defend them lying to customers who are paying for a top of the line item. I think that they really dropped the ball on this one and should make ammends to those of us who they lied to.

Well here is the proof in writing straight off the RX65 box, if this isnt false advertising then I dont know what is;

oh and what the hell is spread spectrum??

I also like the building confidence thing in the top right corner of the box ;)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...n/PIC_0064.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...n/PIC_0065.jpg

some type of x,k,ku,ka, radar all rolled into one..... the spread spectrum!

''spread'' over the frequency ''spectrum''

other than that i'm at a complete loss to what they mean..

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Originally Posted by stalker

oh and what the hell is spread spectrum??

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I think they're talking about "Frequency Hopping"...

oh ok cool...

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Originally Posted by glockman30

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Originally Posted by RadarRoy

Ok guys I understand your concerns but...

You go to the store, buy brand name computer with all the latest gadgets and the newest CPU. Lets call it model a-1.

The company advertises that all software upgrades for THIS computer you bought are free from all threats.

Well NEW threat emerges, software update itself cannot stop this threat, it takes a new CPU and motherboard change.

Computer manufacture redesigns their computer with new CPU, motherboard, and software. New computer a-1-x50

Now are you entitled to an “free upgrade” for this new computer, think not..

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Not a "free upgrade", just not having to put out another $300 every 2-3 years. The key point here is the advertisement of upgradeable when it is not.

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I agree, they never said free upgrade... and I don't think we on this board nessesarily expect a free upgrade, but some sort of upgrade path is to be expected...other than "trade in."

Right on the escort website it says:

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Passport 8500 X50's on-board computer can be reprogrammed to detect new radar and laser threats, making it a solid investment.

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So much for that eh?

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Originally Posted by glockman30

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Originally Posted by PassportToSpeed

I've heard this a few times and sorry about that for you. I believe the 8500 was "software upgradable" same as the X50 is now. I presume the reason why you couldnt upgrade to pop is because it has to do with the hardware and not the software. Try to think about it this way. If you bought yours in 01, the V1 has had software and hardware revisions since then that you pay for each time (well after the warranty period) the money that you saved during that time is close to being able to buy the x50. Crunch the numbers of the revisions plus the extra $100 you spent extra for a v1 back in 01 and in those 4 years you could have an 8500 new in 01 and an x50 new in 05.

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I know I had a x50 blue for 14 months and when I sold it I lost $90 and two months out of warranty I paid $60 to have it updated/fixed. I have heard a lot of people having problems wth their Belscort products on this website. I knew KU was coming and I was not going to take a chance of getting nothing for my "upgradeable" x50 when it became obsolete with no KU band detection. Also Escort's customer service is terrible. There is also the issue of the x50 not picking up quick triggered KA in Jammer Tests's videos. There are some assumptions here, but for piece of mind I sold mine on ebay and I am looking at buying the V1.

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Roy would nver allow this to happen that is why it is VERY smart to buy from Radarbusters.com

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Originally Posted by jimbonzzz

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Originally Posted by stalker

oh and what the hell is spread spectrum??

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I think they're talking about "Frequency Hopping"...

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your as good as mike valentine when you talk about the stuff! :lol:

you do know your stuff.... i know thats been said before but i've said it again! :lol:

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Originally Posted by laserblaster

your as good as mike valentine when you talk about the stuff! :lol:

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Thanks! :wink:
But I don't know if I'll EVER be THAT good.
Doesn't mean I can't try though... :lol:

Jim

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Originally Posted by stalker

Well here is the proof in writing straight off the RX65 box, if this isnt false advertising then I dont know what is;

oh and what the hell is spread spectrum??

I also like the building confidence thing in the top right corner of the box ;)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...n/PIC_0064.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...n/PIC_0065.jpg

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"Highest Possible Capability".....a clever play on words that leaves the "back door" open.....They're not claiming it Can be.....just that it has the highest possiblilty to be.

Having said that ....I agree it's less than ethical advertising...

We should call them and ask them for an explination. The number has been added to the original post.

Just wanted to add my unpleasant experience with the escort people as a frame of reference on this topic. I LOVED my X50 when I had it until I called asking a few questions about newer models....They treated me like I was a moron and hung up on me for asking "do you plan on updating the X50 anytime soon for new technologies so I can plan accordingly".....After 3 phone calls and several emails of them replying in an uppity, indecent manner, I gave up on their so called dedication to customers. I spoke with my wallet, by getting rid of my X50 and getting the V1...whose people treated me very nicely and whose detector is amazing. I have no respect for Belescort, they will never see another dollar from me. Sucks for them, I will by buying detectors for all my cars now and in the future and they will not see a dime of it.

Unfortunately Belscort does not care about their customers.

What i know about their customer service is that i sent them a email 2 weeks ago and i got no reply.I know that calling is to best way to reach them but litlle faster email replies would be good.

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Originally Posted by stalker

oh and what the hell is spread spectrum??

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A little more info on this...

For a while now people on the forum have been wondering about a version of the Stalker that can "frequency hop", because of references from such places as copradar.com about such a gun.

Well here's another piece of the story:
Around 1991 and 1992, the Stalker was being introduced in a new section of the Ka band and required FCC approval of the new frequency range (34.2-35.2). They introduced their units at 34.7 GHz, and supposably said that a "Spread Spectrum" gun was in the works, that could supposably "frequency hop" throughout the entire 34.2-35.2 range. But there's no confirmation that this gun ever saw the light of day.

However, I'll bet that this is the reason for putting "Spread Spectrum" on the RX-65 box.

All I can say is that we had better hope that they haven't been working on a "Spread Spectrum" gun for the past 13 years...

Jim

I wish detector companies would release a "roadmap" like other industries (eg. CPUs) do. Then we could all plan our purchases and so forth.

I agree with you on the Norton and all Software upgrades, however the upgrade to POP was more then a software upgrade, it was a hardware upgrade.

A software alone would not allow the older 8500 units to receive POP, it took a new antenna and processor.

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Originally Posted by LS1-Camaro

I have an Escort 8500 non X-50. Part of the reason I bought it when it was new in Jan of 01 was because it was advertised as "upgradeable for new threats", never obsolete. Well, I Escort today to ask them which firmware version I have and if I should upgrade to "pop" because a year ago this april they told me that they are going to have a pop upgrade available in September of 04. The lady informed me that not only has there never been a performance upgrade for the 8500, but that there are no plans to update it. She told me it was an "engineering decision" not to offer a pop upgrade and that the 8500 will not be upgradeable to KU. I feel as they duped tens of thousands of us who bought the 8500 and that it was merely a technological pit stop en route to the 8500X50. That would be Ok of they didn't advertise it as upgradeable, which was a scam designed to take sales away from the V-1. I would have bought a V-1 if I knew they were lying. At least I could have sent it in for an upgrade without hassle. Anyone else buy an 8500 with the hopes of having it upgraded and feel duped??? I feel almost as if this is grounds for a class action law suit. If they are going to give up on the 8500, Escort ought to offer the 8500X50 to current 8500 owners for the reasonable cost of what they would charge for an 8500 upgrade. Thanks for letting me vent.

Here is their number if you want to call them and voice your concearn:

1-800-543-1608

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I have also heard that Escorts customer service is very bad. This is something that I really wish they would do better at.

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Originally Posted by RadarRoy

I agree with you on the Norton and all Software upgrades, however the upgrade to POP was more then a software upgrade, it was a hardware upgrade.

A software alone would not allow the older 8500 units to receive POP, it took a new antenna and processor.

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I am not an electronics engineer, but they have engineers working for them and they promised me over a year ago that the 8500 would be upgradable for POP and wemnt as far as telling me that the release wuld be in September 2004.