Newbie has questions regarding latest radar detectors

Hello,

I have been out of the radar detector loop for almost 18 years going back to the early 90's when the primary technology was X band, K band, and Ka band. Fast forward 18 years later and I'm in the market for protection for my 2008 BMW 335.

I would to purchase something that has front and rear protection, i.e. sensors installed by a trained technician on front and rear of vechicle, etc. I have been reading about radar jammers and laser jammers on this forum and have even read about Veil.

My question is; what are some recommendations of hardware / protection? I have read that some radar detectors have modular connections for laser jammers, but I'm not sure if this compatibility has drawbacks, i.e. a good laser jammer and a sub par radar dectector or vice versa.

Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.

Thanks, Owen

Best Dash-mount radar-detectors (In no order):

V1
Bel Sti
Escort 9500i
Escort 9500ix
Escort X50
Bel RX65

*Note: In the above the X50, RX65 are the cheapest, and performance is nearly negligibly behind the others listed... they are older but by all means still considered top-tier... the 4 other units also have a few major 'features' the 2 mentioned do not have, but it comes at a steep price: $100+*


Both these models below have not been as extensively tested (as they are very new to the market, but they should have similar performance to the above detectors, because they are just a port from an already existing detector.

(Escort C65)
(Bel GX65)


Best REMOTE models:

Escort 9500ci
Bel Sti-R

The 9500ci is by most considered the only real choice of the two. They both have extreme sensitivity (much information says: they are the most sensitive units [regarding radar] ever seen in the industry). The 9500ci has a GPS feature to lock-out the many false alerts you will receive with the unit though, which is a HUGE plus. It also has front and rear laser jammers (ZR-4). The jammer is considered somewhat lack-luster, but can provide adequate protection to the (front) of a car if paired with Veil G4. The rear is still somewhat of a ticket notifier... but can in favorable conditions be useful.

The price point here is 2x-3x the dash-mount units.

Ok, so it all comes down with 2 products. A remote mounted RD that has front and rear antennas OR a Valentine One that is a windshield mounted RD which has a front and rear facing antennas. It also has directional arrows pointing in the direction the radar is being emitted from. It all depends on which one of those you are going for.

For laser jammers, they are illegal in some states. Check the link and see if they are illegal in your area.

Guys Of LIDAR - Laser Jammer Laws

And be sure to check out their testing results of the laser jammers

Guys Of LIDAR - Field Testing


You mentioned Veil, Viel is effective in absorbing laser for a short distance. It is meant to be used in conjunction with a high-performance RD that can alert you of the laser and the Veil will absorb the laser so you can slow down and eventually the LIDAR gun will punchthrough and get your speed. Remember, Veil is more effective on a darker car because lighter cars reflect the laser more easily. Here is a video demoing Veil

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DgCb26PgMY"]Veil G4 Testing[/ame]

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Originally Posted by stevo1569

Ok, so it all comes down with 2 products. A remote mounted RD that has front and rear antennas OR a Valentine One that is a windshield mounted RD which has a front and rear facing antennas. It also has directional arrows pointing in the direction the radar is being emitted from. It all depends on which one of those you are going for.

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There is no remote RD that has front and rear radar antennas.

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Originally Posted by AirMoore

There is no remote RD that has front and rear radar antennas.

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None that we would recommend anyhow.

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Originally Posted by samq45

None that we would recommend anyhow.

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Correct! There most certainly is one, but I won't mention who makes it! ;)

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Originally Posted by okorkie

Hello,

I have been out of the radar detector loop for almost 18 years going back to the early 90's when the primary technology was X band, K band, and Ka band. Fast forward 18 years later and I'm in the market for protection for my 2008 BMW 335.

I would to purchase something that has front and rear protection, i.e. sensors installed by a trained technician on front and rear of vechicle, etc.

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I'm wondering what you mean by front and rear protection? If you are talking about radar, any good RD can easily detect radar that originated sron the rear of the vehicle. However, only the V1 can tell the user whether the signal originates fron the front or rear of the vehicle. If you are talking about laser, laser jammers can be purchased for both front and back protection for one price, or just front protection for a lesser price.

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Originally Posted by okorkie

I have been reading about radar jammers and laser jammers on this forum and have even read about Veil.

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Jamming radar is a Federal crime, so I highly discourage this approach. A good RD can give one excellent protection against radar threats and it's perfectly legal everywhere in the US except Virginia and Washington DC. Detecting radar is a more recommended option around here.

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Originally Posted by okorkie

My question is; what are some recommendations of hardware / protection? I have read that some radar detectors have modular connections for laser jammers, but I'm not sure if this compatibility has drawbacks, i.e. a good laser jammer and a sub par radar dectector or vice versa.

Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.

Thanks, Owen

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We need your budget constraints and the area you drive to begin to give meaningful suggestions. RDs range from good enough for about $150 to ridiculously good for $1600. Laser jammers range from probably good enough for about $400 to crazy good for about $1200.

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Originally Posted by okorkie

Hello,

I have been out of the radar detector loop for almost 18 years going back to the early 90's when the primary technology was X band, K band, and Ka band. Fast forward 18 years later and I'm in the market for protection for my 2008 BMW 335.

I would to purchase something that has front and rear protection, i.e. sensors installed by a trained technician on front and rear of vechicle, etc. I have been reading about radar jammers and laser jammers on this forum and have even read about Veil.

My question is; what are some recommendations of hardware / protection? I have read that some radar detectors have modular connections for laser jammers, but I'm not sure if this compatibility has drawbacks, i.e. a good laser jammer and a sub par radar dectector or vice versa.

Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.

Thanks, Owen

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Just to add, i think a good laser jammer and a good radar detector will cover your chances of getting a speeding ticket to less than 10 %. The rest of the 10 percent is the threat of VASCAR (ground or airplane), pacing, visual guestimation, and INSTANT ON radar of which you should still have good chances of detecting if there are some rabbits ahead of you.

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Originally Posted by djrams80

Correct! There most certainly is one, but I won't mention who makes it! ;)

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Suffice it to say though that its performance is lackluster.

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Originally Posted by MEM-TEK

Suffice it to say though that its performance is lackluster.

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And its performance is nowhere near its price tag and I mean, not in the same galaxy!

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Originally Posted by Event Horizon

Just to add, i think a good laser jammer and a good radar detector will cover your chances of getting a speeding ticket to less than 10 %. The rest of the 10 percent is the threat of VASCAR (ground or airplane), pacing, visual guestimation, and INSTANT ON radar of which you should still have good chances of detecting if there are some rabbits ahead of you.

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And a good chance if you are using the STI-r or 9500ci. The remote mounted detectors just seem to sniff out that weak IO shot. Like DJ said expect to spend $750 to $2800+ to have complete protection.

As others will probably mention too one of your best, cheapest countermeasures for highway driving might just be a CB. I would love one just can't bring myself to man up (as Stealth Stalker said) and install one on the Corvette.

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Originally Posted by djrams80

And its performance is nowhere near its price tag and I mean, not in the same galaxy!

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I was at the Dealer today having a new clutch installed (long story). There was a person there who just won the lottery and was getting a new porsche and they purchased the unmentionable product. It was a real show of salesmanship - For that Price I think you can get a V1, 9500ci and an LI.

I was pretty happy though since I no longer felt like the biggest sucker there for paying the stealership prices. I was also thinking - How long will this person have there license thinking they are protected with the "best" ........... well according to the salesman it was:dontknow:.

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Originally Posted by category4

And a good chance if you are using the STI-r or 9500ci. The remote mounted detectors just seem to sniff out that weak IO shot.

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I think GOL should test these remote mounted detectors to see the true scope of the improvements, if any, especially on various Ka freqs.

But for weak IO shots I think the V1 covers pretty well and I'd rather spend the $$ on laser jammer then on remote mounted Rds. They're just pricey as heck.

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Originally Posted by Event Horizon

I think GOL should test these remote mounted detectors to see the true scope of the improvements, if any, especially on various Ka freqs.

But for weak IO shots I think the V1 covers pretty well and I'd rather spend the $$ on laser jammer then on remote mounted Rds. They're just pricey as heck.

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My locals have switched over to the Stalker II from the Stalker ATR. This sucker seems alot harder to detect. Twice now, I've seen the V1 miss an I/O shot that my 9500ci picked up. The 9500ci is definitely better than the V1 for these scenarios.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkP8XL0fOY8]YouTube - Stalker Instant On, 9500ci alerts to 1st shot, V1 misses it[/ame]

I've seen this video but I think these are some exceptions. GOL did IO tests and V1 hasn't missed a Ka shot there. My V1 hasn't missed any Ka IO shots i've experienced about 2 of them. So there may be something going on with your V1.

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Originally Posted by Event Horizon

I've seen this video but I think these are some exceptions. GOL did IO tests and V1 hasn't missed a Ka shot there. My V1 hasn't missed any Ka IO shots i've experienced about 2 of them. So there may be something going on with your V1.

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How would you know if your V1 missed an I/O shot?

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Originally Posted by djrams80

How would you know if your V1 missed an I/O shot?

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im sure to myself that I havent. I have seldomly passed a LEO just sitting in a speed trap position with no alerts from V1, and if he IOs another car behind me when i pass, im confident that the rear antenna will alert me. This hasn't happened. Often times when I go in this situation they are just looking down on something, maybe paperwork, or theyre on a cell phone.

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Originally Posted by Event Horizon

im sure to myself that I havent. I have seldomly passed a LEO just sitting in a speed trap position with no alerts from V1, and if he IOs another car behind me when i pass, im confident that the rear antenna will alert me. This hasn't happened. Often times when I go in this situation they are just looking down on something, maybe paperwork, or theyre on a cell phone.

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You might have picked up an I/O shot, but was that the only shot that was detectable. As in my video above, there were two seperate I/O shots that were detectable. The V1 missed one and detected the other one. If the shooter had been a little more selective, or if I had made that light, I easily could have been in the target area without the V1 alerting me. There are defintely scenarios where the V1 would not be good enough to save the driver from a ticket, where the 9500ic/STi-R would be.

As per your earlier comment, my V1 is working properly. I got about a 1.5 mile 35.5Ka detection in the city last night with it. It also went back to VR within the last couple of months for the ghosting fix(not fixed but better than it was). It came bak hotter than when I bought it brand new.

This is where I feel the V1 lacks, 34.7Ka. I'd say this is the only frequency that my 9500ix can hang with the V1. Don't get me wrong, the V1 is an excellent RD, but I'm spoiled because I get to see what the 9500ci is capable of every day. Against these newer, lower powered radar threats, I think the V1 and everything less sensitive than the V1 is going to have a rough time. Trust me when I tell you that these Stalker IIs are no joke and are going to get people with even good RDs drilled.

yea I see. My point is that 1500$ is not enough to justify picking up an IO shot that is missed by a windshield mount. Rare, rare rare. I seldomly encounter true IO. And if they are doing IO, then they are rampant about it and a windshield mount will detect it. Furthermore, having rabbits or traffic of anykind upfront for that matter decreases the chances of IO ticket. If you want to speed at night in the wee hours with no traffic in sight, no detector will save you.

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Originally Posted by Event Horizon

Rare, rare rare.

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I'm pretty sure I've seen it twice in the last month, but the second time I couldn't find the shooter, so I'm not 100% on that. The frequency was right on 34.7 though in this same jurisdiction, so it's a good bet. My point is that with these new guns, these scenarios might become alot less rare.

To say that the extra cost doesn't justify the extra sensitivity is a personal decision for all of us to make. After having these two experiences, the only RD I trust against this gun is my 9500ci.

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Originally Posted by Event Horizon

yea I see. My point is that 1500$ is not enough to justify picking up an IO shot that is missed by a windshield mount. Rare, rare rare. I seldomly encounter true IO. And if they are doing IO, then they are rampant about it and a windshield mount will detect it.

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Perhaps where you are this is very rare, but not around here - i/o and laser is the norm. If there is CO it is usually an accident or a trooper with a customer. I have had several encounters where the STi-R was the only detector to alert to these i/o. Also do not forget about forward facing and moving i/o.

Common tactic is moving i/o and even if they wait a full minute before hitting the remote between i/o bursts the combined intercept speeds and distance at 70 mph would make most windshield detectors miss the first i/o alert at 2 miles or so. Throw in a curve and the windshield mounts are all pretty much useless in this situation.

Here in NY the troopers are taught to sit there for lengths of time of up to 5 minutes before they hit the remote for the i/o and moving i/o is really deadly. They want to specifically catch people with detectors and this is certainly one way to catch them and the Troopers are quite good at it, as some members here can attect to.

This is the main reason I have the Sti-R. It is not rare here and when I only have 34.7 enabled I get alerts that I did not think were even possible to detect. With that said, most people would not find it worth $1,000 for the STi-R, but I certainly do. Ever hear of the driver assessment in NY? 6 points (2 tickets) and you pay $700 or even a bit more. Each Ticket is $150-$200 plus the $700 driver assessment. I would rather give my money to Bel/Escort.

You level of protection should match your threats (as many members have beaten to Death several times). If you do not face much I/O then the V1 or even a Whistler is going to save you and these remote mounts would be overkill.

acknowledged my friend. I don't know about NY sounds nasty but here in West Florida the primary threat is Laser an CO radar. IO is sparse.

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Originally Posted by Event Horizon

yea I see. My point is that 1500$ is not enough to justify picking up an IO shot that is missed by a windshield mount. Rare, rare rare. I seldomly encounter true IO. And if they are doing IO, then they are rampant about it and a windshield mount will detect it. Furthermore, having rabbits or traffic of anykind upfront for that matter decreases the chances of IO ticket. If you want to speed at night in the wee hours with no traffic in sight, no detector will save you.

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I've seen it once and that is enough to justify the $1600. Would have cost me more than that over 3 years (time it's on your record) for 87 in a 70 between fines and insurance increases.

Everyone has decide what the threats are, what risks they are willing to take, and how much they are willing to spend to minimize those risks.

Thanks everybody for the input... I really appreciate the suggestions. I think I will end up going with the Passport 9500ci. I can pick one of these up on Ebay (~$1200 - brand new and never registered with Passport) and then have it installed for around $400 after calling a couple of places in Atlanta.

Unless anybody thinks otherwise, I plan to purchase this in the next day or so.

Cheers, Owen

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Originally Posted by okorkie

Thanks everybody for the input... I really appreciate the suggestions. I think I will end up going with the Passport 9500ci. I can pick one of these up on Ebay (~$1200 - brand new and never registered with Passport) and then have it installed for around $400 after calling a couple of places in Atlanta.

Unless anybody thinks otherwise, I plan to purchase this in the next day or so.

Cheers, Owen

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Hi Owen,

Considering what you are about to spend on a 9500ci (I have one myself) for God's Sake please buy one from an authorized Escort dealer, or you will NOT have any warranty! Almost all of the eBay sellers are NOT authorized dealers. Same applies for Amazon as well. At the very least, pick up the phone and call a few of the authorized dealers such as Radarbusters or others who have independent web sites and who do not sell on eBay. You might be able to get a really good deal by calling. Just a thought...

:)

I agree with MEM-TEK. Using an unauthorized dealer for these products is a bad idea. Of the three RDs I currently own, all were bought in the last year or so and all three have been sent back to the manufacturer for some reason or another. You're taking a huge risk by buying off of Ebay. If you were talking about $150 RD, that would be one thing, but this bad boy is expensive.

Also, the 9500ci is updateable via internet downloads. I don't even think that you would have access to these downloads without proper registration. I know for a fact that you wouldn't be able to get the RLC database downloads.

After looking at the Specification sheet on the Stalker 2 unit, I was amazed at how low the power output is:


STALKER ® II MDR Moving Radar
GENERAL SPECIFICATIONS
Type: Handheld Moving/Stationary Doppler Radar
Operating
Frequency: 34.7 Ghz (Ka-band)
Stability: ±100 Mhz
Battery Type: Removable/rechargeable sealed battery handle containing a
7.2 Volt Li-Ion battery
Cell Capacity: 2000 mah
Power
Requirements:
Removable Battery Handle: 7.2 VDC nominal
Cigarette Plug Coil Cord Handle: 7.0 to 18.0 VDC.

Power Output: 10 mw mininum
25 mw nominal
50 mw maximum

RFI : An RFI message indicates the presence of an interfering signal.
Operation is inhibited during an RFI indication


This is one of the lowest power output for any radar gun period. This unit makes cheap radar detectors a thing of the past. You need a detector with all the sensitivity and good filtering you can get. Another thing is fast detection time is an absolute must.

Whistler1 :D

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Originally Posted by Whistler1

After looking at the Specification sheet on the Stalker 2 unit, I was amazed at how low the power output is:


STALKER ® II MDR Moving Radar
GENERAL SPECIFICATIONS
Type: Handheld Moving/Stationary Doppler Radar
Operating
Frequency: 34.7 Ghz (Ka-band)
Stability: ±100 Mhz
Battery Type: Removable/rechargeable sealed battery handle containing a
7.2 Volt Li-Ion battery
Cell Capacity: 2000 mah
Power
Requirements:
Removable Battery Handle: 7.2 VDC nominal
Cigarette Plug Coil Cord Handle: 7.0 to 18.0 VDC.

Power Output: 10 mw mininum
25 mw nominal
50 mw maximum

RFI : An RFI message indicates the presence of an interfering signal.
Operation is inhibited during an RFI indication


This is one of the lowest power output for any radar gun period. This unit makes cheap radar detectors a thing of the past. You need a detector with all the sensitivity and good filtering you can get. Another thing is fast detection time is an absolute must.

Whistler1 :D

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Thanks a ton! I knew it was more difficult to detect and that there was something special about it. This proves it. Like I said earlier here, this sucker is much harder to detect than the older ATRs that I don't see anymore. This radar gun is going to cost even those people with pretty good RDs I/O tickets. It's no joke.

What kind of car are you driving and what part of Atlanta do you live in? I am close by and would be willing to help you install it and save you the $400 install fee, you will probably have to redo it anyway.

Get it from an authorized dealer, fleabay is trouble when it comes to electronics in my opinion.

Interesting, I wonder what the difference is between the STALKER II MDR and the STALKER II DSR, other than being hand held. I get great detection range and my local STALKERS, they use DSR's though.