Sorry guys this may have been asked before but when exactly will the arrows patent be expired?
If it did expire, who do you think would jump on the multi antenna bandwagon?
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Sorry guys this may have been asked before but when exactly will the arrows patent be expired?
If it did expire, who do you think would jump on the multi antenna bandwagon?
I think the professor made an educated guess at this and determined that it was February 2011. I'll look for the thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by vcs
Edit: Found it:
http://www.radardetector.net/forums/...rd-escort.html
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbonzzz
I don't think Mike Valentine is stupid enough to let others steal his idea.
It doesn't matter how stupid or smart Mike V is. The law is the law.Quote:
Originally Posted by th3 factory freak
That would be a death blow to V1. I'm not a big fan of his detector, but competition is good ... Escort needs a serious challenger. Cobra and Whistler are not going to push them, that's for sure.
I would love to have the arrows and GPS with the capability to mark locations in one detector :)
x2, if that blow hasn't already been struck, which sucks for us consumers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Obsidian
I just wish all those hooligans who have said (since the Sti came out) 'VR has something up their sleeve, my mothers, friends, brothers, dog said he heard it, and soon it will blow you away.' were right, but as I always suspected, I think change at VR is coming way too late... if it ever does.
The ONLY THING that 'keeps Belscort prices in check' as is right now is the V1, if we lose that... I would hate to see what they could charge for high-end RD's... since the competition will be ZERO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon_Doh
Too bad since there will be no competition for Belscort that detector will cost $2,500+ dollars... because if you want such a detector, you have only one place to turn to... thats in a few years of course.
Maybe Mike can whip up a little airplane bogey tracker function to add on to the V1.
I'm sure Mike will hire a really good attorney that will find loops and holes to get his patent re-patented. I believe the law is that to get it re-patented you have to show evidence that you NEED that patent in order to keep your business going...or something along those lines
But I'm not attorney either so I could be very wrong.
I'm no attorney either, but from the way I understand the patent laws, he has no shot. First off, patent extensions are very rare, but they do happen. My understanding is that for a company to be granted a patent extension, that company has to prove that their initial investment, plus a reasonable amount of profit, has not been obtained. Basically, you have to prove that you haven't made any money yet from your patent. This is clearly not the case here.Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperSalad
One of my largest customers, a monster pharmaceutical company, with a team of attornies, recently filed for two patent extensions and were denied.
Aside from Escort having noone to compete with cost-wise if this happens (i.e. - charging even MORE insane prices for their detectors), I welcome the opportunity for Escort to build on the "2 antenna/Arrows" idea. Especially since I've already been impressed by Escorts rear detection without having a rear antenna. I'd probably be in line to buy providing all TrueLock/Autolearn functions are able to be shut off by the user.Quote:
Originally Posted by djrams80
Not sure why you would bother. If you turn off the GPS features, you basically have a V1.Quote:
Originally Posted by RadarKid
yea I guess thats true. a V1 with less sensitivity. OK... you're right. I would just keep the V1. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by djrams80
no to hijack this theard but when v1 patente expires with it arrows and bel escort makes a detector with arrows. But Mike V makes another totally awesome detector with more sensitivy then the bel escort but without arrows of courese. Which one would you guys buy.
Any RD with more sensitivity, without finding a way to deal with the added false alerts, will not be useable in my opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by V1 on the go
Wait, so let me get this straight. So hypothetically Mike V. loses his patents for the arrows. So then Belscort would then start their own patent for arrows (basically the same thing as Mike V's arrow patent) and then the V1 would no longer be able to have arrows? I guess then VR would have to wait another 20 years to get their arrows back and then Belscort would be stuck arrowless lol.
My original though was that it would be a free for all in that both VR and Belscort can use the arrows freely.
When a patent expires, everyone is able to freely use whatever was patented. No one can repatent an expired patent.Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperSalad
he could repatent the arrows under a different business name, there loopholes on every single lawQuote:
Originally Posted by djrams80
honestly in my opinion...I see both sides here.Quote:
Originally Posted by djrams80
From one point of view, I don't think ANYONE should be able to have a stab at someones personal invention. They should have sole rights over it, and have say who (if anyone) can use their invention.
From the other point of view, in some ways its good that patents expire, as almost all technology is improved on by taking someone elses "invention" and updating or revising it to keep if from becoming stagnant.
Most likely Belscort will not have arrows, it will simply have an itty bitty rear antenna and will display or voice "Front" or "Rear".
But, the most fascinating thing to me is how they are going to shove the rear antenna in there. They seem so slim. The thickness of the V1 works because of the 'analog' display and rear antenna.
No way. The USPTO is not full of a bunch of dumbasses! Any attempt to repatent an expired patent would not be approved, guaranteed.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeonSector
Exactly. patents are a good thing, because they spur invention. If someone has a brilliant idea, they should be able to reap the benefits of that idea. But, at some point, the rest of the world gets access to that idea, in order to further develop whatever the original idea was. 20 years is plenty long enough for any company to have sole rights to any invention.Quote:
Originally Posted by RadarKid
Does the patent mean that there can be NO directional indication of radar signals?
I think it could be done with a digital display like a "Compass Face" where the arrow would turn in the direction of the signal. No need for a plastic arrow that lights up.
I dont know about patents but they could probably do something like this now and it would be better in my opinion than the current V1 setup.
The patent specifically calls out "the use of two independent radar horns to determine strongest source/direction"
And probably something about arrows, but if Belscort were to come up with a different way to determine the direction without 2 horns, I would imagine they could get around the patent even now.
Well, here's the patent. The patent call for the use of "at least two" antennas to determine the direction of the radar source. Pretty tough to get around that!
United States Patent: 5151701
Quote:
at least two antennas in a single housing
They would have to pull one out of their butts and not use any antennas! That would be truly unique, if its even possible.
Or they could just use two housings...
I think this is patented by the unmentionable company.Quote:
Originally Posted by FoolishOne
Interesting....
Never knew that.
Maybe they can concoct some kinda gel that reacts differently at different frequencies. Maybe a change in voltage or something. Like a solar panel tuned to absorb a different frequency. The relative strength would be hard, but you would know its presence. But obviously light is not the same as RADAR.
"The radar detector includes at least two antennas and preferably three or more antennas..."
^^^ a pretty genius and dick move on Mike's part. If it was just two (like they have always used!) than someone could put 4 antennas.
Also, why hasn't escort used directional alerts in two separate housings for the custom units? Maybe b/c that will admit the value of the arrows and hurt sales of their other units?
BTW, if VR hasn't started working on something new for when their patent expires they are idiots.
I wish Mike V would log in one more time, and make a post in the V1 section saying, "We are working on something."
That would be enough for my Zombie-self.
I'm not sure what tricks mike has up his sleeve or if he's got any, i've noticed he's just had another patent for noise suppresion passed in nov 08.
But there is no sign of anything to do with stealthing the v1, but i really think it's too late, esspecialy for european drivers, since my v1 broke i no longer use any detector, theres not much need because i only use the local roads and i'm careful when i go out.
With the credit crunch, high taxes and bad roads in the uk i no longer enjoy driving........
I'm tired of the 100 or so "VR is coming out with something big soon" rumors. They never materialize. I think those of the school of thought that Mike V has enough money and is unwilling to take any real chances in business at this point in his life have won me over.Quote:
Originally Posted by laserblaster
could be...but the bottom line is none of us knowQuote:
Originally Posted by djrams80
He really hasn't come up with any innovations since the arrows in the original design. When the V1 came out it was way ahead of the competition and since its introduction it has been enhanced incrementally. The problem is it's now long in the tooth and falling behind the competition, but Mike V. doesn't seem to notice and stubbornly sticks to the original concept. But maybe he's got something revolutionary on the drawing board, but I doubt it. Valentine is a small niche company and I think they lack sufficient R&D resources to innovate a new product.
It depends on what's patented. You can usually get around it...
Get around what? Patent expiration? No way! Patent extensions are very hard to come by. Why does everyone around here seem to think that the USPTO is a bunch of idiots?Quote:
Originally Posted by speed-dreams
Well looks like Mike V has two years to do it!Quote:
Originally Posted by AirMoore
Because they grant high level extremely vague and general software patents maybe :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by djrams80
What makes anyone think that the arrows patent expiring will change the detector industry?
Escort still makes fine detectors that compete with the V1 without using arrows and dual radar antenna's why would they spend money to develop another detector when their current ones are doing fine competing:confused:
As for the Escort fanboys b*tching about V1 coming out with nothing knew...enjoy your over priced Escor 9500i or 9500xi which performance can't compete with the V1
Valentine one makes the most sensitive dash mount detector. Why some boring idiots are stuck driving one car every day go ahead and enjoy your 9500ci. My mood though changes frequently and I like to drive different vehicles when ever i can