Ultimate Radar Detector Review '05 - Bel, Escort, Valentine

OK,

You guys have waited long enough! The review we have been working on for over a month, now, has been completed and is now ready.

We have opted to announce the public release to the members of this forum first as an expression of thanks for the support we received from a good number of you. We are calling it:

The Ultimate Real-World Radar Detector Review 2005.

We hope you agree and will find this review/comparison one of the most thorough that has ever been undertaken.

We welcome an open discussion of our findings with all y'all.

Enjoy!

The Veil Guy 8)

On the first page of the full review (the what's included page) you have a bad link when you click on the detector names. There is an "i" before the www that's throwing things off.
Richard

Thanks. Got it.

Was dissappointed the detectors were tested side by side. I don't think any of the the detectors can perform to the maximum in this setup.

I don't think that really has an affect at the upper levels of detectors. What I was disappointed in is the fact that nothing is the most sensitive on all bands. So while I like the detector review I'm disappointed in the detector makers. The v1 came close except for Ka if you disregard falsing, but Ka is important...maybe v1.9 :lol:
Richard

They were not tested directly side-by-side and there was a good amount of distance between them.

Having spoken to a number of individuals [prior to the test] who know about detectors, it was expected that they would get along ok with this setup - provided I didn't push it with more than two in one vehicle operating concurrently.

This wouldn't be true for all detectors just these three as they have the highest level of shielding.

At any rate, the rate at which these detectors alerted to real threats was entirely consistent with their solo operation.

The Veil Guy 8)

For what's it worth,

All detectors provided plenty of time to react to the genuine traps we encountered.

Being first (quickest) may be somewhat overrated for the following reasons:

1) May come at the expense of increased "falses"
2) Too much range [to instant on, in particular] could throw a user off. If you pick-up an alert from 10 miles away, will you actually drive slower for 10 miles or start to inch back up after a little bit of time goes by when things are quiet?

We are talking small degrees of excellence here.

The Veil Guy 8)

Great review!! I think it is awesome that they are all good in their own way and people should base their decision on what features are important to them. I just wish that the V1 was mounted at the top of the windshield where I believe it is more sensitive than others but that's just my opinion. I'll have to read the review again to check whether they were on at the same time or not.

I have been saying this since day one. FEATURES are what distinguish these detectors apart NOT performance.

Now only if escort or vr would copy the intellimute...

I like the V1's mute system. I keep the main knob at 2:00 or 3:00 depending on where I'm driving and I keep the mute knob at 11:30 or 12:00. I have no problem reaching up to hit the mute.
Richard

After being exposed to the automute of either the Bel or the Escort, I got spoiled. It really is a wonderful feature - no leaning.

And when the Valentine falses frequently on K/Ku* band, it only does so briefly at full-volume for one or two cycles oftentimes before you could hit mute.

My understanding is things may change in the summer time - that the RX65 and 8500 X50 may tend to false more on Ka [than the new V1]

We'll just have to wait and see. Anyone drive during the summer with these other units? If so, what's been your experiences with Ka alertings?

The Veil Guy 8)

*Ku and K alert with same tone.

As comparing the RX65 to summertime and winter Ka falses, I didn't notice any with mine. Maybe a few more POP falses, but hard to say there.

Wow, it's just awesome and your review has particularly open the window in my knowledge of radar detector. Very informative and better than other
reviewers. My salute and honor for your efforts and all the hardworks in this input. Thank you very much, SIR..

Agreed, thanks Veil Guy. I was suggesting an X50 to a friend because I thought the alerts were louder on it, guess he'll be getting an RX65 now!

Very complete review.

Thanks for your test Veil Guy,

Quote:

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"As we made our way back towards Wickenburg, AZ north on Vulture Mine Road (and located in the middle of the desert) the v1.8 “falsed” multiple times to very weak K-band while the X50 remained silent.* We had a good laugh – even when we were in the middle of the desert, the V1 alerted to K-band.*What on earth was it listening to?*An overhead satellite?"

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Test shows the performance on the big three is neck & neck that's what keeps the performance on the cutting edge.

I know the V1 falses more on K band however I think In this case the V1 was falsing with the X50 as I ran two V1's last week (one picks up the other on K band)
Have to read it again but did you only have one POP experience?
How was falsing with this?
I think the V1 will win the false POP test as I have only had a 1.8POP version almost week now but almost 1000 miles and not one false POP. Still waiting for that fancy J code alert. Did get an occasional Ku with only one LED a few times.

I am not sure.

VR hasn't suggested that this could have been the cause and we have run the V1 many times in solo operation and have noticed an increase in K/Ku alerts on the same circuit relative to the other detectors including the v1.7.

The V1 we had did not specifically have a distinct POP alert - just standard K and Ka - so indentifying of POP alert was impossible to do.

The Veil Guy 8)

*Ku alerts with same tone as K and can be confused with one another!

Ya I believe POP comes on just like an instant on close range (full alert)
Did you have POP turned on, all units?

i never realized the bel was so loud

Yes POP was enabled as we know Nevada has at least 70 BEE III's in operation.

Ku was disabled on the detectors capable of Ku reception since Ku is not currently in use within the US. This may change shortly, though.

The Veil Guy 8)

crazyVOLVOrob,

Did the video clip demonstrate this well to you?

The Veil Guy 8)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The Veil Guy

Yes POP was enabled as we know Nevada has at least 70 BEE III's in operation.

Ku was disabled on the detectors capable of Ku reception since Ku is not currently in use within the US. This may change shortly, though.

The Veil Guy 8)

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It was? Looked to me in the V1 startup that Ku was enabled. Oh, and the videos were very good at convincing me I like the V1 sounds the best, that the x50 is quiet, and the rx65 is seriously loud.
Richard

Those video clips were taken after the test.

These were shot within the last two weeks just to demonstrate to visual/audio differences.

The Veil Guy 8)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The Veil Guy

crazyVOLVOrob,

Did the video clip demonstrate this well to you?

The Veil Guy 8)

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So well especially the clips with music, being 19 i'm alwasy listening to music,and in the summer i drive all the time with the windows down, i need a loud detector, i'm gald i got the bel

Yes, RX65 is one of the loudest even the factory default setting is audible enough to alert me whilst listening to my radio and particularly I like the compact size and visual display suitable for right hand drive. Luckily got myself a right detector with full satisfaction.

several problems with this test...

1) all 3 radar detectors were running concurrently...

whereas in previous tests that were conducted, it was recommended that THIS should NOT be done... Now it's "OK" to have 2 or more detectors running side by side? 26 inch separation just wont cut it. please explain.

2) placement of the V1 wasnt optimal. as stated in the manual, for best performance, mount HIGH. Why wasnt this done? higher placement on the windshield can mean several seconds of detection time.

3) continuous negative side notes having issues with the V1. Throughout your test this is done. You say that the arrows can be misleading, then at the end you absolutely love it.

4) This experience demonstrated, once again, that the Valentine requires a bit more driver involvement to properly interpret what information is actually being conveyed. Something one gets used to doing, after living with this detector for an extended period, and am in no way being critical of this behavior, either - merely pointing out a fact.

This is your opinion, not fact. You are pointing out your opinion.

5) during the x-band back to back trap detection in NJ, no mention of the V1 bogey counter

6) when mentioning Radar Roy in your article, you need to disclose that he SELLS the X50 and RX65. You should also disclose that you are one of the Admins on this site, which is ran by Radar Roy, who also SELLS the X50 and RX65. Full Disclosure.

examples of the Bias.... Even though the X50 and RX65 weren’t in operation at the time, given the strength of the radar, we are certain they would have sounded their alerts as well. The V1 with its arrows, did allow us to quickly identify the source of the threat, although it wouldn’t have made a bit of difference as we immediately slowed down even before we actually noticed the arrows.

2 points... first one being, how can you be certain they wouldve detected it? if it aint been run, it aint been done. you are assuming in a fact testing situation. bad idea. 2nd point is, how you praise the arrows, then quickly follow it up with an "although".

It was a nice effort, but too many errors. Many of the stated issues with your test can be resolved by editing your article.

please do not delete my post.

Thanks

I agree brent . i did like the picture of the V1 mounted with the bell x50, rx65 straped to it and they had some problems with the V1 mount at times come on. other than that good work. sorry veil guy i just dont wont to put your sticky stuff on my nice mercedes.THaxs anyway
P.s looks like you like a beer or 2 so cheers
Pps please do not delete my post aswell

I agree that I don't think the detectors were tested very well. Things could have been done better. This is just my opinion, what do I know?

These are 3 high end detectors, and there wont be interferience between the 3. Brent, stop taking everything so d*mn personal about the V1!! All detectors mounted high will recieve better warning, so all three mounted low is not going to give advantage to one over the other.

The arrows are off! Me having a V1- I know this. If you are traveling with traffic, radar will bounce off of cars and the v1 arrows will be dancing all over the place. Does it happen much? No, but it still happens.

Quote:

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2 points... first one being, how can you be certain they wouldve detected it? if it aint been run, it aint been done. you are assuming in a fact testing situation. bad idea. 2nd point is, how you praise the arrows, then quickly follow it up with an "although".

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I had an x50 for about a year, and if there was a cop behind be, in sight, it would be going off. Maybe not full alert, but it would have still been going off. If your detector is beeping, slow down!!

The veil guy has no reason to be biased, thats one of the great things about his review. Sorry that you didn't like the results.

OK.

Let's take the commentary one at a time.

Brent_Vino:

1) We did not conduct performance comparisons with three detectors running. As clearly stated, we only did this (1st day) to compare the ergonomic differences souch as audio and visual capabilities.

2) We actually ran the detectors in a variety of positions high, low, center, left, and right during the test to mix it up. And if one is most concerned with detecting laser, low is better than high. Put 'em where you want. At any rate in any heads-up comparison they were placed at the same vertical location and therefore subject to similar conditions (high, low, or center.)

3) I have now owned three versions of the V1 for more than 15 years - including one of the first series. How many have you owned and for how long? The simple fact was that the latest V1 did false substantially more on K-band relative to the other two and so it was noted.

4) I did point out a fact and not opinion. When the arrows indicate a source (in that case from behind) that was actually in front, then it does require more driver interpretation than if one were just be confronted with an alert.

5) What does the bogey counter have to specifically do with my driving route to NJ? If we had come across a trap with the bogey counter where it would have made an impact, then we would have commented to that effect. Further, the RX65 and 8500 X50 have the ability to indicate multiple radar sources as well. Perhaps not as many as nine, but multiple none the less.

6) We are certain the detector would have alerted to the rear as the strength at the time was a full 9-10. We had passed other sources of radar that were much weaker in strength where the other detector alerted. As stated in the article, during our driving, the Valentine - as expected with a rear antenna - tends to alert for a longer period to a passing rear radar threat - but at this level the signal strength on the V1 tends to be less than three.

Ghz1:

For one test run series in NJ we positioned (attached) the RX65 right below the V1 only running one or the other at a time to confirm that some alert timing differences were attributed to placement.

StealthJamal:

This review was as balanced as I could have possibly have made it in real-world driving conditions (ie; speedtrap encounters.)

I stand by the results and believe they are representative of our experiences.
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BTW, of course Roy is in the business of e-tailing detectors and jammers, etc. What's there to hide and this forum's readers already know that now, don't you?

The thing to realize is that VEIL is not in the business of selling radar detectors or jammers. Ultimately, it makes no difference to me which detector does what - other than what I would choose to take with me during my trips.

If some of you want to read my review as biased, faulty, or whatever that is your prerogative. Drive with what you want to drive with and be happy. I am not here to bust your bubble.

At any rate, it doesn't appear that you read the entire comparison and are only taking specific commentary. Plenty of good things were said about all detectors because there are plenty of good things about each. No mention of those comments in your flame here, though.

But that's all right. The work represented many hours/days of effort and if one doesn't find it appealing then one can discount all of it. Ultimately, it makes no difference to me.

For what its worth, I gave each of the manufacturers an opportunity to respond to this review and to point out any factual inaccuracies prior to its public release. Talk about being even-handed. I did not set out to blindside anyone and invited their commentary - not some emmisary's.

BTW, how many of you guys actually have every driven for any period of time with either the RX65 Pro or the 8500 X50?

As I stated earlier, I stand by these results and the commentary.

Happy and safe motoring gentlemen.

The Veil Guy 8)

One final comment concerning this previous commentary.

Any "bias" and/or historic "preference" - if I had any going in to this test would have been for the Valentine as that's what I have driven with and have come to know intimately.

The fact that both of the other detectors "broke-through" any preconceptions that may have existed is a testament to how good they actually are today.

The Veil Guy 8)

Hey guys, we should be very much appreciate of Veil Guy presentation of his sincere and honest review and I don't see any bias at all. Instead we should be grateful for his effort and time to post such a wonderful thread for all of us to enjoy readings.

Agreed

I have read many reviews on detectors and BY FAR Bob's is the most honest and factual. GREAT job Bob

Yeah i know Mr Veil dude you worked hard 10/10 rock on! :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The Veil Guy

One final comment concerning this previous commentary.

Any "bias" and/or historic "preference" - if I had any going in to this test would have been for the Valentine as that's what I have driven with and have come to know intimately.

The fact that both of the other detectors "broke-through" any preconceptions that may have existed is a testament to how good they actually are today.

The Veil Guy 8)

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Thank you for responding, you are a stand-up guy.

However, when doing "independent" studies or tests, you need to disclose your relationship, if any, that you have with any particular subjects, so that the reader isnt misled. To do otherwise is dishonest. You have a business relationship with Radar Roy and RadarBusters.com.

I dont care if the V1 came in first place or not... That doesnt matter. What matters is if you pick the RX65 in being your choice, most readers of your article will not know that you have a relationship with someone that SELLS the RX65. Radar Busters also SELLS the Veil. This must be disclosed as well.

Again, I appreciate the tests.. it seems like you worked really hard and you did a great job! However, I feel certain that the tests that were conducted are subjective and definately suspect, due to your business relationship.

I am sorry if I offended anyone, however people should know.

Thanks

That is a good point you bring up. EVERY reviewer should mention their ties prior to doing ANY review.

Excellent review!

I don't see any bias in it. It showed real life use.
The bottom line is all 3 are great detectors. it comes down to driving style (rural/city) and features that appeal to each individual.

I agree...should have been told about the relationship with radarroy.

However...doesnt radar roy sell ALL of those radar detectors?????? How can there then be bias?

Yes, absolutely very open and transparent review and strictly unbiased....