Dslrip32's Redline Test Report...

Well as some of you know, after discovering issues with my previous Redline, Dslrip32 was gracious enough to send me his Redline to give it a thorough shakedown. The unit arrived to me on Friday via Ups overnight. I was unable to road test it this weekend due to prior commitments but was able to bench test the unit. Where my unit was within the first 40 units produced, this Redline is a much later build date.

Upon powering up the unit on the bench, all seemed normal, I went ahead and did a factory reset of the settings ensuring there were no modifications on any of the settings. I then proceeded to fire various K and Ka band radar guns at it to see if I could identify any sort of glitch or delay. All seemed well, with a slight delay on 35.5 in comparison to 34.7. The 35.5 delay was only a mere .5-1 second slower in alerting than it was to 34.7. Overall, the unit performed fine.

Tonight, Elvato and I were able to road test the unit, here is where things got interesting. Be began our first test with a Stalker ATR 34.7 Ka gun in constant on mode. Here is where we noticed our first glitch of the night. On the very first run against constant on radar, it failed to alert to the gun until about 600 feet from the gun which was operated in C/O mode. This result seemed very similar to the issue my unit had on 35.5 where it had a significant delay in alerting to a radar signal for the first alert. Following runs were conducted and the unit seemed to perform fine, detecting radar at a range consistent with other comparable units. I feel this glitch is almost catastrophic to performance, I was able to attain a speed via radar and had a visual of the vehicle long before the unit alerted. The unit did not have any major issues reporting I/O radar.

We then proceeded to test the unit with a Kustom Talon Ka 35.5 radar gun. As with the Stalker, we began with a C/O run. Everything seemed normal upon first detection of the radar. When the target vehicle was about 700 feet away from the radar source, the unit stopped alerting to the radar for a period of about 2-4 seconds. This performance issue is consistent with my Redline unit which has since been returned to Escort for "Priority/Same day Repair". We then tested this unit against 35.5 I/O and did not notice any notable abnormalities in performance.

Finally, a K band test was performed in both C/O and I/O modes with no notable performance flaws.

After testing a second Redline unit, it appears Escort Redlines are plagued with a variety of different performance issues. Where my personal Redline had delay issues on 35.5, this later production unit had issues on 34.7 detection. Both my redline unit and this unit had the issue with dropping 35.5ghz alerts. While an Escort customer service representative explained to me that Escort had recognized a software issue with the Redline, the Escort forum representative stated that it was only my specific unit affected. After testing this unit and noticing similar performance issues, I personally do not believe that my personal unit was the only unit affected by poor performance.

I was originally planning on allowing Escort to repair or replace my unit and giving it another test. I was promised by an Escort reprentative that my Redline was marked as a priority repair and that it would be repaired or replaced on the day they recieved it. UPS indicates that the unit arrived to them Friday 10/9/09 at 9AM local time. It is now 10/15/09 and I still have not recieved any form of communication from Escort. After testing this particular unit, I think I will be giving Escort a call and telling them to keep my Redline.

I hope all this makes sense, we just finished testing and its about 4am here and I'm pretty tired. Videos will be posted as soon as possible.


Videos:

Dslrip Redline vs 34.7

Dslrip Redline vs 35.5

Thanks for your time guys, interesting results, glad I didn't order one.

If it's not too much trouble, I would like to see if Escort can fix your's.

If it comes back to you with glitches, we will know that Escort has a problem they can't yet figure out.

But if it comes back and works as advertised, we can all have some hope that Escort is at least capable of making this thing work.

Thanks for all your time and effort, BTW.

I'm betting it's a software issue, and as such all Redlines are affected. Due to it being somewhat intermittent, it may not have turned up in QA testing. Embedded software is complex, sometimes bugs aren't found until the device is released. The STi 33.8 issue is an example.

As long as Escort takes it seriously and issues a fix, it shouldn't be a long term issue. I wouldn't be returning my Redline over it. I'll just send it in once a fix is confirmed.

That said, my Redline has been awesome so far. Mine has pretty consistently beat my V1 on everything except for rear shots, obviously. It picks up off-axis signals my V1 misses, on K, 34.7 Ka and 35.5 Ka (there's no 33.8 around here).

Discouraging. I have an unopened Redline sitting here that I ordered from Amazon, just arrived yesterday afternoon. If I return it unopened I can get a full refund from Amazon, so it may be going back. I'm thinking that returning it and getting an STi Driver may be the way to go.

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Originally Posted by steve f

Discouraging. I have an unopened Redline sitting here that I ordered from Amazon, just arrived yesterday afternoon. If I return it unopened I can get a full refund from Amazon, so it may be going back. I'm thinking that returning it and getting an STi Driver may be the way to go.

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That would be hard for me to send it back without testing myself. But i do see your point about sending an unopened box back. It seems like Kpatz got a good unit and some of you all didn't.

Thanks Cbr for the testing. I noticed these glitches right away with my unit, but had no Radar gun or guns to duplicate this and document this. This is why I sent it to you, and I really appreciate the testing you have done. And also you to Elvato, thanks for your time also! Hopefully Escort will get yours back to you fast. I would be willing to bet though, that they send you a completely different unit with later serial number though. Just a "hunch". Also If you need to hang on to mine a little while longer to test against yours when you get it back, please do.

Oh well, so much for my order. I'm calling Escort to cancel my shipment today!
Thanks, :(
Dan

A good unit? Maybe. I don't see much I/O in my regular travels, much less QT. I did see some odd glitches when bench testing, but that's a totally different environment than "on the road with LEOs".

I guess it all boils down to what you encounter on a day-to-day basis. If you see lots of I/O and QT, then the Redline, or any Belscort for that matter, won't be ideal for you, and you should get a V1. If you see more C/O than I/O, and/or the I/O isn't highly selective or QT, then the Redline may be a good choice.

Me... I like the fact that the Redline and V1 get along together, so I can benefit from both. Redline's sensitivity + spec mode, and V1's arrows, rear antenna and bogey counter adds up to a killer combination. I feel safer running both, since if one misses something, chances are the other will pick it up. Also, running both helps ferret out Cobra falses as well, as these usually only set off one or the other RD, not both.

Short of VR and Escort merging and becoming Escortine, or Valscort, we probably will never see the "perfect RD". But we'll always have choices.

How could Escort blow this one, when neither the STi-R nor the 9500ci have this problem? Totally baffling! Makes no sense!

http://propaneapp.com/images/facepalm.jpg

First-off thank you so much CBR and Elvato for your testing (Elvato I still owe you cd's I know)...




Secondly:


The FLATLINE is FAIL. Words cannot describe how (Insert derogatory phrase) Escort is. Its unbelievable to think that you already have 3 units in the stable like this (Sti... Sti-R... 9500CI), and the RD falls apart like removing the critical block in Jenga. Not only that, but they toted it like it was the Titanic... and they certainly got a Titanic!


Seriously: We know know why they re-badge all their units now across the 2 brands: Its because they know that its the only way for them to not muck up a 'new' unit release.


Sounds like the Beta-testers, oops: consumers---- Are doing their job.


Basically there are probably a few hundred units out there with this possible problem (OR problems) right now, yet I would say ~3-5% will ever get it fixed... do they not realize how bad it makes them look?

Unless Escort does two things:

A) Notify ALL users with the impacted build dates via email/shipping address/website announcement as a recall of sorts; then for them:
B) Get a true, 100% fix right now... 100% free to the consumer (including shipping)... and even throw something extra in there (hardwire on the side for their troubles).

Mike Valentine must be laughing his ass off because he is actually getting more sales from Belescort releasing the redline. :D Right now I would take a 940 over the redline, at least I know it will alert consistently.

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Originally Posted by languy99

Mike Valentine must be laughing his ass off because he is actually getting more sales from Belescort releasing the redline. :D Right now I would take a 940 over the redline, at least I know it will alert consistently.

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:eek:


Very true about the Mike Valentine part. The more (Beta-junk) Escort releases, the more his product looks better, by doing nothing...

Thanks for testing this. There is no way I will be purchasing a redline now.

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Originally Posted by djrams80

How could Escort blow this one, when neither the STi-R nor the 9500ci have this problem? Totally baffling! Makes no sense!

http://propaneapp.com/images/facepalm.jpg

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I was thinking the same thing because i don't remember any of you with the CI and the STI-R having this problem. I think this is going to turn into an expensive loss or it already has.

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Originally Posted by kpatz

A good unit? Maybe. I don't see much I/O in my regular travels, much less QT. I did see some odd glitches when bench testing, but that's a totally different environment than "on the road with LEOs".

I guess it all boils down to what you encounter on a day-to-day basis. If you see lots of I/O and QT, then the Redline, or any Belscort for that matter, won't be ideal for you, and you should get a V1. If you see more C/O than I/O, and/or the I/O isn't highly selective or QT, then the Redline may be a good choice.

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It is for this reason that I now use my V1 as my primary detector. I have encounterd I/O and QT more than I care to mention and because of that, I do not trust my Escorts. The first time I encountered QT, my ix remained silent as I passed a LEO with a stalker ATR hanging out the window. Just recently, I was in Elvato's truck when we got blasted by I/O and by some miracle of god, he did not get a ticket.:D

These were just preliminary tests. We'll try to test further, to see if we can find some sort of consistency. Granted, that might have to wait until next week, if dsl doesn't mind.

Well, I just called Escort and although my Redline was marked as Priority/Same Day repair it is still at Escort in service. According to the guy on the phone, the service technician left a note saying that he was having trouble with servicing and has multiple technicians helping him to get it repaired. :confused: As of right now, I have not canceled my repair, I guess I will let it play out before I make any final decisions.

Probably because there's nothing wrong with the hardware. It probably tests fine on the bench, and it's a software issue that they have to get the software engineers cracking on.

And if Escort is like most companies these days, their software division is likely overworked and understaffed.

Once the engineers identify the problem and make a fix, it has to be tested, both to make sure it fixes the issue and doesn't create other issues. I bet the QA department is understaffed too (or that one software engineer is also the QA department).

Then they'll flash Cbr's Redline with the updated firmware and send it back to him, and hopefully it'll work to our satisfaction.

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Originally Posted by ELVATO

These were just preliminary tests. We'll try to test further, to see if we can find some sort of consistency. Granted, that might have to wait until next week, if dsl doesn't mind.

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I don't mind, take your time guys, my V1 is protecting me.:D

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Originally Posted by dslrip32

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Originally Posted by ELVATO

These were just preliminary tests. We'll try to test further, to see if we can find some sort of consistency. Granted, that might have to wait until next week, if dsl doesn't mind.

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I don't mind, take your time guys, my V1 is protecting me.:D

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Glad I went with the V1 over the Redline at this point ... I'm sure the Redline will be fine after they work out the bugs, but using one now is playing with fire. :eek:

I'm glad to see you guys were able to duplicate the results dlsrip had been seeing with his detector.

Shame on Escort for trying to spin this into a non-issue after their tech admitted to the flaw. :stupid:

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Originally Posted by Cbr

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Originally Posted by kpatz

A good unit? Maybe. I don't see much I/O in my regular travels, much less QT. I did see some odd glitches when bench testing, but that's a totally different environment than "on the road with LEOs".

I guess it all boils down to what you encounter on a day-to-day basis. If you see lots of I/O and QT, then the Redline, or any Belscort for that matter, won't be ideal for you, and you should get a V1. If you see more C/O than I/O, and/or the I/O isn't highly selective or QT, then the Redline may be a good choice.

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It is for this reason that I now use my V1 as my primary detector. I have encounterd I/O and QT more than I care to mention and because of that, I do not trust my Escorts. The first time I encountered QT, my ix remained silent as I passed a LEO with a stalker ATR hanging out the window. Just recently, I was in Elvato's truck when we got blasted by I/O and by some miracle of god, he did not get a ticket.:D

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With the QT and your V1, do you have the pop off or on?
Thanks.

Hopefully by the first of the year, the redline's bugs will be fixed.

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Originally Posted by Obsidian

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Originally Posted by dslrip32

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Originally Posted by ELVATO

These were just preliminary tests. We'll try to test further, to see if we can find some sort of consistency. Granted, that might have to wait until next week, if dsl doesn't mind.

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I don't mind, take your time guys, my V1 is protecting me.:D

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Glad I went with the V1 over the Redline at this point ... I'm sure the Redline will be fine after they work out the bugs, but using one now is playing with fire. :eek:

I'm glad to see you guys were able to duplicate the results dlsrip had been seeing with his detector.

Shame on Escort for trying to spin this into a non-issue after their tech admitted to the flaw. :stupid:

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:eek:
You are the last person I would have expected to switch to the V1

http://viximo.com/images/sad_cat.jpg

Damn, better luck next time Escort.

Well after seeing Escorts continuous denial of the issue (see the "other" forum) I just went ahead and canceled my repair order. After doing all this testing on 2 separate units and noticing similar flaws and hearing 2 different things from different Escort Reps, I decided that I just didnt want to deal with it anymore. Maybe down the road, I'll consider buying a redline, but as of right now, I'm done with it. If anyone would like to send me a Redline that is newer, I'd be more than happy to test it to see if they've resolved the issue. But as it stands right now, I'm done with it and am considering selling all my Escort units (PM me if you're interested:)). I really hope escort gets everything straightened out, best of luck to them. I am done being a lab rat for them with nothing but denial from them.

Hey CBR, did you get any video when you and ELVATO were testing the 2nd Redline? Maybe you could send it to Escort to show them that there is some kind of glitch in all the Redlines.

You happen to have this Redline on video like the other one?

I've posted this before...... if you buy a Belscort product brand new you are a guinea pig customer. I learned my lesson with the X50 and then again with the STi. You should wait at least a few months after a Belscort new release to have a better chance of getting a bug free detector.

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Originally Posted by Cbr

Well as some of you know, after discovering issues with my previous Redline, Dslrip32 was gracious enough to send me his Redline to give it a thorough shakedown. The unit arrived to me on Friday via Ups overnight. I was unable to road test it this weekend due to prior commitments but was able to bench test the unit. Where my unit was within the first 40 units produced, this Redline is a much later build date.
.............

I hope all this makes sense, we just finished testing and its about 4am here and I'm pretty tired. Videos will be posted as soon as possible.

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Question - does the Redline have a function to display the firmware/software revision number? I just received shipping confirmation of my Redline and it would be interesting to see if it has been modified since those other units.

I will try to have videos posted tonight, I've just been busy.

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Originally Posted by OpenRoad

Question - does the Redline have a function to display the firmware/software revision number? I just received shipping confirmation of my Redline and it would be interesting to see if it has been modified since those other units.

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The redline does not specify what software revision it has on it.

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Originally Posted by Cbr

Well after seeing Escorts continuous denial of the issue (see the "other" forum) I just went ahead and canceled my repair order. After doing all this testing on 2 separate units and noticing similar flaws and hearing 2 different things from different Escort Reps, I decided that I just didnt want to deal with it anymore. Maybe down the road, I'll consider buying a redline, but as of right now, I'm done with it. If anyone would like to send me a Redline that is newer, I'd be more than happy to test it to see if they've resolved the issue. But as it stands right now, I'm done with it and am considering selling all my Escort units (PM me if you're interested:)). I really hope escort gets everything straightened out, best of luck to them. I am done being a lab rat for them with nothing but denial from them.

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Thanks Cbr! I have made my mind up also on the issue after the same reasons as yours. Multiple calls, different stories, multiple Q/T tickets with Escort "quiet" products etc. I am done with them also till they get it right and fix their buggy products. The Redline "Crapline" I ordered, I actually had faith in till I noticed these flaws. I did notice the same delay though also on K band. After rebooting it at a gas station on HWY 82 I was about 10 minutes from this K band source which is 2 sets of fixed "your speed is" signs. One is west facing and the other is east facing. I was right up on top of it till it blaired off, about probably 30 to 80 feet from that source. That was when I took it off my windshield and had my mind made of on it, till I saw your proposal of testing it. I did the right thing for this hobby of testers, and took you up on the offer and sent it to you the fastest I could. It cost me a little over $60 USD just to send it and another $10 or $12 for 3 day to send it back. That is dedication on my part to this hobby, and yours also for performing the test as well as Elvato's.

Well, I'm not going to knee-jerk the unit back. I'll give them a couple of weeks to own up to it and fix it. It does show pretty poor QA, however.

That said, being a software guy, I can see this happening. Embarrasing, yes. Sort of like when your little kid supposedly goes up in a balloon and half the world is looking for him, then come to find he's really in the attic. :)

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Originally Posted by OpenRoad

Well, I'm not going to knee-jerk the unit back. I'll give them a couple of weeks to own up to it and fix it.

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Good on you for that. I completely understand the frustration and disgust of those sending them back. But it'll also be nice to see how it is eventually resolved for those who stick it out.

Also I am going to post where these signs I just mentioned are, and I hope I am not breaking any rules here, and if so I am sorry. I just do not want to appear like a liar and making stuff up. This is the location of these k band signs one west bound and the other east bound. These attachments are pdf format, as I don't know how else to post it.

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Originally Posted by dslrip32

Thanks Cbr! I have made my mind up also on the issue after the same reasons as yours. Multiple calls, different stories, multiple Q/T tickets with Escort "quiet" products etc. I am done with them also till they get it right and fix their buggy products. The Redline "Crapline" I ordered, I actually had faith in till I noticed these flaws. I did notice the same delay though also on K band. After rebooting it at a gas station on HWY 82 I was about 10 minutes from this K band source which is 2 sets of fixed "your speed is" signs. One is west facing and the other is east facing. I was right up on top of it till it blaired off, about probably 30 to 80 feet from that source. That was when I took it off my windshield and had my mind made of on it, till I saw your proposal of testing it. I did the right thing for this hobby of testers, and took you up on the offer and sent it to you the fastest I could. It cost me a little over $60 USD just to send it and another $10 or $12 for 3 day to send it back. That is dedication on my part to this hobby, and yours also for performing the test as well as Elvato's.

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Dslrip, do you want me to send your Redline back tonight? You should be able to send it back to Escort for a refund.

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Originally Posted by Cbr

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Originally Posted by dslrip32

Thanks Cbr! I have made my mind up also on the issue after the same reasons as yours. Multiple calls, different stories, multiple Q/T tickets with Escort "quiet" products etc. I am done with them also till they get it right and fix their buggy products. The Redline "Crapline" I ordered, I actually had faith in till I noticed these flaws. I did notice the same delay though also on K band. After rebooting it at a gas station on HWY 82 I was about 10 minutes from this K band source which is 2 sets of fixed "your speed is" signs. One is west facing and the other is east facing. I was right up on top of it till it blaired off, about probably 30 to 80 feet from that source. That was when I took it off my windshield and had my mind made of on it, till I saw your proposal of testing it. I did the right thing for this hobby of testers, and took you up on the offer and sent it to you the fastest I could. It cost me a little over $60 USD just to send it and another $10 or $12 for 3 day to send it back. That is dedication on my part to this hobby, and yours also for performing the test as well as Elvato's.

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Dslrip, do you want me to send your Redline back tonight? You should be able to send it back to Escort for a refund.

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If you are done with it, yes. If your not done with it then no. Either way let me know asap, thanks.

I have a local K-band speed sign I will try mine out on as well. However, my unit won't arrive for a week (UPS Ground).

One thing would be curious, is if they figured out the glitch and 'siltently' fixed it on newer units. Anyway, time will tell...

In the meantime, go watch the MLB playoffs...

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Originally Posted by Cbr

Well, I just called Escort and although my Redline was marked as Priority/Same Day repair it is still at Escort in service. According to the guy on the phone, the service technician left a note saying that he was having trouble with servicing and has multiple technicians helping him to get it repaired. :confused: As of right now, I have not canceled my repair, I guess I will let it play out before I make any final decisions.

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Besides the fact that it is total BS by Escort:


Your Flatline CBR is in the middle of this whole deal:
http://wattsfam.com/gallery/albums/s.../stupidity.jpg

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Originally Posted by stealthJamal

You happen to have this Redline on video like the other one?

I've posted this before...... if you buy a Belscort product brand new you are a guinea pig customer. I learned my lesson with the X50 and then again with the STi. You should wait at least a few months after a Belscort new release to have a better chance of getting a bug free detector.

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Oh don't say that... this is what Escort fears: They lose all of their Beta-Testers. Think of that, they would actually have to do some Beta-testing of their own before shipping the units our way.


Mehhhh never-mind, they would send them out regardless, since most consumers won't have a clue how or why their units are acting as such, and will believe the BS Escort shoves don't their throat when they call back with their ticket.

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Originally Posted by kpatz

I'm betting it's a software issue, and as such all Redlines are affected. Due to it being somewhat intermittent, it may not have turned up in QA testing. Embedded software is complex, sometimes bugs aren't found until the device is released. The STi 33.8 issue is an example.

As long as Escort takes it seriously and issues a fix, it shouldn't be a long term issue. I wouldn't be returning my Redline over it. I'll just send it in once a fix is confirmed.

That said, my Redline has been awesome so far. Mine has pretty consistently beat my V1 on everything except for rear shots, obviously. It picks up off-axis signals my V1 misses, on K, 34.7 Ka and 35.5 Ka (there's no 33.8 around here).

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Agreed - as a software guy myself, been there. I have a co-worker who worked on firmware that ran some alarm system at Heathrow Airport in England. There was a bug in his firmware that caused the terminal to be evacuated. Now that was an embarrasing bug. (It was a PREVIOUS employer, and he only tells you about it after he has a few beers).

I'm not surprised by Escorts great engineering and just outstanding BS customer service. :eek: My 2 X50's i owned were lemons.