Shifting before a turn.

[supercowpowers]

So I had to drive my fiance's mother's 2nd gen CR-V yesterday. It's a manual, believe it or not. As I adjusted everything and tested out the controls I realized I was in trouble - to touch the gas while my foot was on the brake would have required a strange contortion involving nearly lifting my ass out of the seat. My first manual car is my Miata I've had for 3 years. I figured out how to heel-toe within about a week of buying it and I haven't done anything different since then, so I never learned any other way.

I decided that my plan would be to brake a little early and try to downshift before starting a turn. That worked, in that I was drive it, but it completely threw off my sense of timing so I either went into turns too fast or too slow, and sometimes I still ended up shifting as I was starting a turn. That didn't cause any problems at reasonable speeds but I know that's a bad habit.

So my question is: what is the "proper" method? Surely these European countries I've heard about where you have to take your test on a manual have this figured out. My fiance's family all drive manuals, and from observing them I see that they either just lug the engine through the turn and shift afterward, shift during the turn, or just don't bother rev-matching at all.

[ivirovets]

Clutch in before the turn, shift into gear you need, scrub speed before the turn, then in the turn revmatch and off the clutch softly to gas through the turn? That's what I'd do. No need to heeltoe if you're just driving normally not trying to maintain the highest speed possible through the turn, but this is not an expert opinion by far. I don't drive stick too regularly.

[supercowpowers]

Clutch in before the turn, shift into gear you need, scrub speed before the turn, then in the turn revmatch and off the clutch softly to gas through the turn? That's what I'd do. No need to heeltoe if you're just driving normally not trying to maintain the highest speed possible through the turn, but this is not an expert opinion by far. I don't drive stick too regularly.

You're right, it works if you're not trying to maintain the highest possible speed. That's my fiance's brother's method.

The issue with it is that you might not realize you're at the highest possible speed for the traction you have if the road is wet, icy, or you just didn't realize the turn was as sharp as it is. Any mistake in rev-matching during a turn will put an extra load on the tires, which could overwhelm them and cause problems.

[ivirovets]

That's a good point, didn't think about that. Not driving manual regularly I forgot all about the jerk that comes with bad rev matching and the fact that it could cause a loss of traction. Maybe letting off the clutch very slowly would ease some of that? Bad for wear I know but safety..

[AirMoore]

They really need to make people take their road-test in manual cars (as I did)...

THEN make mandatory motorcycle safety courses (even if they don't intend to get a license)... these questions would answer themselves.

[supercowpowers]

They really need to make people take their road-test in manual cars (as I did)...

THEN make mandatory motorcycle safety courses (even if they don't intend to get a license)... these questions would answer themselves.

Right. That's basically what I'm asking, what they teach people to do in places where it's a requirement.

I've managed with my current car for 3 years because I can heel-toe in it. I'm just wondering what you're supposed to do if you're faced with a car that has a pedal arrangement that doesn't support that. I can't think of any good options.

[ivirovets]

AirMoore- I took a motorcycle course and I have a license, They never taught proper shifting on corners in slippery conditions. The class was a joke.

[Obsidian]

You should finish your braking and shifting before the turn, control your car with the throttle and accelerate after the apex ... that's the fastest way through the turn. Downshifting or braking in a turn is a good way to spin.

[switch626]

It will be easier if you get in the habit of using the gas or brake separately (never at the same time). Minor speed adjustments are made with the gas pedal. Once you get comfortable with that things will be much smoother.

The proceess:

1. Push in the clutch and brake as you approach the turn until you reach the speed you want to hold in the turn.
2. Shift into the appropriate gear and release the clutch. You might choose a lower gear and rev a little, which allows you to dump more speed by easing up on the gas (if needed)
3. If in a lower gear, you're set to accelerate out of the turn. If you couldn't do the lower gear, you will have to GENTLY down shift and accelerate out of the turn.

Whether you go with the lower gear depends on the turn, chosen speed, and the gearing of the car. The best advice is to be conservative with your speed when driving a car you don't know intimately well. Go slow in turns until gear selection is second nature.

[supercowpowers]

You should finish your braking and shifting before the turn, control your car with the throttle and accelerate after the apex ... that's the fastest way through the turn.

Right, which is why I heel-toe in my personal car. There has to be an "official, nanny-state approved" method of only using two pedals at once, because not all cars (or drivers) are built for heel-toe.

Downshifting or braking in a turn is a good way to spin.

Right, which is what I meant by "cause problems" when I said "Any mistake in rev-matching during a turn will put an extra load on the tires, which could overwhelm them and cause problems," I just didn't feel like elaborating.

If you can't shift in a turn, that just leaves before it or after it. I've seen that before it doesn't work very well, so I'm guessing that you're supposed to just coast through the turn in a high gear with no throttle and shift once it's obvious you'll make it. I know that's much less fun, but this whole question was provoked by a vehicle that isn't necessarily fun anyway.