Realistic 9500ci Q/T testing

[CJR238]

How can you say that? As Swarga mentioned, there has to be a consistent methodology when testing RDs against Quick Trigger radar shots!

This gets tricky: we need consistent test methodoligies to compare different tests against each other, but in the "real" world, LEO's do not use a consistent method every time...sigh.

As a side comment here, somewhat off track, but worth mentioning, is that if you run a V1 and a Redline in the same vehicle, the V1 absolutely, positively interferes with the Redline. I got a V1 yesterday, and drove home with both units on. I pass 7 known false alerts over a 4 mile stretch on the trip, 6 K and 1 X band, and with the V1 on the Redline only alerted to two of the 7, and I repeated the 4 mile stretch 3 times to be sure. The Redline was almost as quiet as the IX, and the V1 alerted at all the spots where the Redline would normally alert.

X2,

We actually need both consistent test methodologies and more random real world. Like you said "LEO's do not use a consistent method every time" and my last comment to nine_c1 about his video, "we know how to defeat something, but are we realistically testing it? Do we know LEO's use this technique at 2,5? or 6.5? Is it possible the M3 V1 set ups we have see aren't just LEO's doing QT but not getting a reading and trying again?"

Its amazing how Belscorts filter like crazy when being interfered by another RD. This is also why i believe close proximity testing causes errors, i saw this with Jim's TrueLock frequency block testing and many other videos.

Thought: If one RD sitting next to another can cause filtering (delay or no alert at all) why would we believe using a radar gun close in proximity wouldn't do the same thing? Cobras give off strong short KA falsing which the Belscorts filter.

[swarga]

It's better to know the truth than to drive around in ignorance until you see the disco lights in your rear view mirror, wouldn't you agree?

You missed my point swarga...same song different day by the V1 peanut gallery This info is not new so maybe they all should just move on!

I understand, you're a little sensitive. It's kinda like when your wife tells you that she didn't have the Big O for the umpteenth time; it gets really old after a while.

However, you shouldn't take it so personally. The ones who should be upset are the ones who made a $1600 RADAR detector that is outperformed in some categories by a $400 detector.

[nine_c1]

How can you say that? As Swarga mentioned, there has to be a consistent methodology when testing RDs against Quick Trigger radar shots!

This gets tricky: we need consistent test methodoligies to compare different tests against each other, but in the "real" world, LEO's do not use a consistent method every time...sigh.

As a side comment here, somewhat off track, but worth mentioning, is that if you run a V1 and a Redline in the same vehicle, the V1 absolutely, positively interferes with the Redline. I got a V1 yesterday, and drove home with both units on. I pass 7 known false alerts over a 4 mile stretch on the trip, 6 K and 1 X band, and with the V1 on the Redline only alerted to two of the 7, and I repeated the 4 mile stretch 3 times to be sure. The Redline was almost as quiet as the IX, and the V1 alerted at all the spots where the Redline would normally alert.

I agree on both counts.

LEO's are not going to be consistent across the board using this technique, so that leaves us with defining the raw capabilities of the Radar Equipment itself and how our RDs measure up. I'm more comfortable with the added range of the RedLine vs. it's susceptability to missing shots under .5 seconds. However, if I lived in Texas instead of New York, I might have a different view.

The point is, the M3 platform is slower than the competition in it's current form. However, Belscort has the ability to improve response times on the M3 platform and close that gap with the V1 by adding Band Segmentation and RDR to all M3s! Thats why I think it's important to continue to key on this issue until they see fit to provide these features on detectors in the US.

And thanks for posting your experience with the V1 / RedLine combo! No matter how many times this is mentioned, people still think they can get away with running these detectors together by mounting them on opposite sides of the windshield! If an RDD can detect a V1 at 900+ feet, then a RedLine inside the same car cabin can certainly see harmonics being bled out the front and rear horns!

[nine_c1]

Its amazing how Belscorts filter like crazy when being interfered by another RD. This is also why i believe close proximity testing causes errors, i saw this with Jim's TrueLock frequency block testing and many other videos.

Thought: If one RD sitting next to another can cause filtering (delay or no alert at all) why would we believe using a radar gun close in proximity wouldn't do the same thing? Cobras give off strong short KA falsing which the Belscorts filter.

A strong signal from a real Radar source should never create a delay in response...........just the opposite in fact...........unless your SO CLOSE that you overdrive the input on the RD and get no alert at all. The LNA's and Mixers are set up to find very weak signals..........so introducing a full strength signal at 25 milliwatts can saturate the input and dummy up the detector. However, your not going to see this in most cases unless your within a few feet of the detector pointing the Radar gun right at the receivers antenna or getting a very strong bounce within the car. In any case, this is why I use an extended radar antenna cable and point the transmitters antenna away from the RD when bench testing.

As for Cobra's vs a Strong Radar signal.........two entirely different things. The Cobra's leaked LO emissions are just that, leaked! They are not amplified for transmission like police radar and are in fact very weak signals.

The filtering on all RDs is always present and being run as part of a program instruction set. Some of the criteria in that instruction set include signal strength AND presence of multiple signals detected. Belscort's filtering is essentially an oversweep of both X and K bands to find either the primary or 2nd harmonic of another detectors Local Oscillator. If it finds one, it will not alert to a relatively weak signal in the Ka frequency range as that could be the 3rd harmonic of the leaky LO being detected. However, if the signal being detected in the Ka frequency range exceeds a certain power threshold, the Belscort will disregard the 1st and 2nd LO detections and alert to the strong Ka signal. This is why running two detectors in the same cabin does not entirely kill the detection capability of either detector.........it just kills the range one would normally expect.

[CJR238]

The funny part about whan all the QT hype is said and done the factors involved are:

1- The LEO needs to be running QT in your area frequently.
2- The LEO needs to trigger it fast enough so not to alert your RD.
3- They also need to do it slow enough so they can get a reading.
4- They need to see the quick speed reading and know which car is doing the speeding.
4- They need to hide the fact that they are using such a technique. (easy part)

Then add the Radar Detector factor if it can pick up QT:

1- The LEO needs to QT a car ahead of you to get any warning.
2- Your RD needs to be sensitive enough to pick up that QT at a good distance.
3- You need to be the obvious one speeding when in a group.

Boy are we diehard fanatics.

[CJR238]

Its amazing how Belscorts filter like crazy when being interfered by another RD. This is also why i believe close proximity testing causes errors, i saw this with Jim's TrueLock frequency block testing and many other videos.

Thought: If one RD sitting next to another can cause filtering (delay or no alert at all) why would we believe using a radar gun close in proximity wouldn't do the same thing? Cobras give off strong short KA falsing which the Belscorts filter.

A strong signal from a real Radar source should never create a delay in response...........just the opposite in fact...........unless your SO CLOSE that you overdrive the input on the RD and get no alert at all. The LNA's and Mixers are set up to find very weak signals..........so introducing a full strength signal at 25 milliwatts can saturate the input and dummy up the detector. However, your not going to see this in most cases unless your within a few feet of the detector pointing the Radar gun right at the receivers antenna or getting a very strong bounce within the car. In any case, this is why I use an extended radar antenna cable and point the transmitters antenna away from the RD when bench testing.

As for Cobra's vs a Strong Radar signal.........two entirely different things. The Cobra's leaked LO emissions are just that, leaked! They are not amplified for transmission like police radar and are in fact very weak signals.

The filtering on all RDs is always present and being run as part of a program instruction set. Some of the criteria in that instruction set include signal strength AND presence of multiple signals detected. Belscort's filtering is essentially an oversweep of both X and K bands to find either the primary or 2nd harmonic of another detectors Local Oscillator. If it finds one, it will not alert to a relatively weak signal in the Ka frequency range as that could be the 3rd harmonic of the leaky LO being detected. However, if the signal being detected in the Ka frequency range exceeds a certain power threshold, the Belscort will disregard the 1st and 2nd LO detections and alert to the strong Ka signal. This is why running two detectors in the same cabin does not entirely kill the detection capability of either detector.........it just kills the range one would normally expect.

Exactly, close proximity testing causes errors. That's exactly what i experienced (no alert at all within 5ft). And some pretty weird stuff at 20ft.

[nosbusa]

If an RDD can detect a V1 at 900+ feet, then a RedLine inside the same car cabin can certainly see harmonics being bled out the front and rear horns!

nine_c1, wouldn't be safe to say running a V1 with either a CI, or STI-R, would interfere with both remotes? Especially considering a RDD can detect a V1 at 900+ feet as you said.

I've see comments on here saying that a V1 wouldn't interfere with the remotes, but even with the metal & engine between the remotes and a windshield RD your still only talking about a distance of 4-5 feet.

[CJR238]

If an RDD can detect a V1 at 900+ feet, then a RedLine inside the same car cabin can certainly see harmonics being bled out the front and rear horns!

nine_c1, wouldn't be safe to say running a V1 with either a CI, or STI-R, would interfere with both remotes? Especially considering a RDD can detect a V1 at 900+ feet as you said.

I've see comments on here saying that a V1 wouldn't interfere with the remotes, but even with the metal & engine between the remotes and a windshield RD your still only talking about a distance of 4-5 feet.

It depends if what a RDD picks up from V1 interferes with the remote. And from the amount of people running remotes with V1's is any indication it definitely doesn't effect it enough to make any real difference.
However I found my 9500ix interfered with my CI in certain rare circumstances, but the V1 hasn't yet.
I also found that hood cover helped reduce any effect they have on the remote.


Also i believe the RDD distance for the V1 was around 5-600ft?

[snoopyc4]

The funny part about whan all the QT hype is said and done the factors involved are:

1- The LEO needs to be running QT in your area frequently.
2- The LEO needs to trigger it fast enough so not to alert your RD.
3- They also need to do it slow enough so they can get a reading.
4- They need to see the quick speed reading and know which car is doing the speeding.
4- They need to hide the fact that they are using such a technique. (easy part)

Then add the Radar Detector factor if it can pick up QT:

1- The LEO needs to QT a car ahead of you to get any warning.
2- Your RD needs to be sensitive enough to pick up that QT at a good distance.
3- You need to be the obvious one speeding when in a group.

Boy are we diehard fanatics.

Hey, sh*t happens. Come on down to the great state of Texas and see for yourself.

[CJR238]

The funny part about whan all the QT hype is said and done the factors involved are:

1- The LEO needs to be running QT in your area frequently.
2- The LEO needs to trigger it fast enough so not to alert your RD.
3- They also need to do it slow enough so they can get a reading.
4- They need to see the quick speed reading and know which car is doing the speeding.
4- They need to hide the fact that they are using such a technique. (easy part)

Then add the Radar Detector factor if it can pick up QT:

1- The LEO needs to QT a car ahead of you to get any warning.
2- Your RD needs to be sensitive enough to pick up that QT at a good distance.
3- You need to be the obvious one speeding when in a group.

Boy are we diehard fanatics.

Hey, sh*t happens. Come on down to the great state of Texas and see for yourself.

I have some relatives in TX, was always fun visiting them. We got to sit in the back of the pickup and drink beers while getting a sun tan driving down the highway, go tubing down the Guadalupe River and drink beers, sit on the water and drink beers. Come to think of it we drank beer allot.... Ill triad that for QT any day.